E8: Christine Moore – Yoga, Dance, and Yoga Therapy

Christine Moore is a yoga and dance teacher and yoga therapist based in Palisade. Christine and I chat about the difference between yoga and yoga therapy, the different classes she teaches – both regularly and for special events like the upcoming Grand Valley Yoga Fest, yoga philosophy, the history of belly dancing, what always draws her back to Palisade, how she takes care of herself so she can best take care of others, and lots more.

For more info about Christine and her classes and other offerings, check out her website: christinemooreshimmyogini.com

For more information about the Grand Valley Yoga Fest, check out their website. 100% of the proceeds of the festival go to mental health and suicide awareness programs in the Grand Valley: grandvalleyyogafest.com

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that shares a snapshot of the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Today I’m talking with Christine Moore, yoga and dance teacher and yoga therapist here in Palisade.

Christine and I chat about the difference between yoga and yoga therapy, the different classes she teaches – both regularly and for special events like the upcoming Grand Valley Yoga Fest, yoga philosophy, the history of belly dancing, what always draws her back to Palisade, how she takes care of herself so she can best take care of others, and lots more.

Like why she is drawn to work with the populations she works with:

CM: I was really inspired, and am really inspired, to work with people that are challenged to get to the mat vs. people that can like hop in a car and be there and are super athletic. I like to help people find results, and that’s what really excites me about yoga.

The meaning behind her sword dance:

CM: I like the concept of cutting away that which doesn’t serve. Clearing the space. Making room. So it’s not really a weapon, so much as it’s a, something to transform, to change, and to shift. And it’s fun. For me, I’ve always loved dancing with a sword.

And about what teaching yoga and dance has meant to her:

CM: Oh, I think it’s saved my life, in so many ways. In my own experiences with trauma in my life and a lot of loss, and just a lot of different challenges that life has, it’s really helped motivate me. And I think in helping – I don’t even like the word helping, because I love to bring out what people already have inside. That’s why I feel I do more than helping them. They’re helping me.

All that and more, on today’s Postcard From Palisade.

Christine Moore (CM): I’m Christine Moore and I like to start by just letting people know that I’m a yoga teacher. I’m a dance teacher as well. And a yoga therapist. The difference being that a yoga therapist works more one on one with people and helps them with personal challenges and working with a doctor or with a physical therapist to address specific things that yoga can help with. So it’s a little different than regular yoga class.

Lisa McNamara (LM): Do you need special training or anything for that?

CM: Oh, absolutely. I think there’s only two or three possibly certified yoga therapists in Mesa County. So, there is quite a bit of extensive training, and for me, I had about ten years of working with people with disabilities in group homes and veterans at the VA hospital. I worked for five years at the Boulder County jail. So I had a lot of experience under my belt already with working with different populations. And yes, there’s extensive extra training from yoga certification.

LM: Interesting! So, tell me about your path to yoga – how did you get started?

CM: Oh, gosh. I was teaching dance for several years and I had a dance troupe in Boulder, and I started feeling like I needed more for my dance, so I thought yoga would be an interesting add-on, since I always enjoyed taking yoga classes. So I really started yoga to enhance my dance practice. And then, during the training, my son was serving in Afghanistan and one of my fellow teachers brought me an article about teaching veterans, and I felt like my skin tingled, you know, as I read it. I thought, wow, this is something I’d like to do.

So I looked into it, right after I was certified, and started at the VA hospital in Denver, and that just started the rest. I was really inspired, and am really inspired, to work with people that are challenged to get to the mat vs. people that can like hop in a car and be there and are super athletic. I like to help people find results, and that’s what really excites me about yoga.

LM: I saw that you had a link to an article in the Huffington Post about your work with veterans and with people with disabilities, and it just sounds like such a rewarding group of people to work with.

CM: It’s very rewarding. It’s really lovely to have people come to you and let you know that it’s really changed their life and that in itself is just very fulfilling.

LM: And how did you get to Palisade?

CM: Oh, well, my son moved here several years ago. He graduated from college and said he’d go apply for a job in Grand Junction, just for the experience, and then ended up finding work here and getting hired. And so, once he and his partner at the time decided to have a child, they invited me. Five years ago. I moved here two weeks before she was born, and I came for that. The invitation came and it just felt like the right time. I felt like Boulder was outgrowing me. It’s really changed, and I had been there for fifty years. So it was a lot to let go of, but I’m really happy with making that decision.

LM: Yeah, that’s tough though, to let that go and to move to somewhere totally new.

CM: It is tough, and yet I can hop in the car and be there in four and a half hours.

LM: Yeah, good point!

CM: And I have plenty of places to go stay and visit and people to see. I really miss the people. When I go over there now, it changes so rapidly that I kind of feel like, I can’t wait to get back home! Which surprises me. Because I do, I love the front range, I love Boulder, but it has really changed a lot, and a lot of those changes break my heart. So. I like the small town, small community.

LM: Where and what do you teach here in Palisade?

CM: In Palisade I teach at the community center, I call it, the Veterans’ Memorial building, and we move outside in the – probably next week, we’ll start yoga in the park, right over here at Peachbowl Park. And I also offer some privates at my home studio, so I like working one on one with people to really help them enhance their yoga practice or benefit from learning more about what they can do for themselves to improve their health.

LM: For the classes here in town that anybody can sign up for and take, who do you want to welcome into those kind of classes?

CM: I really like to look for people that want something a little different than a regular studio has to offer. Maybe they’re a little intimidated by that, or they might be working on a personal injury. So a lot of my students are a little older, and some are coming from a background of just having an injury or not really feeling like they fit into a regular studio class. So I can offer them like a safe space.

I offer different, I don’t like to call them levels, but more so options for people, so if some people want to really push themselves a little more, they can, and other people can find a way to feel safe in their body. So I’m always watching for what it is that the people that I’m teaching need, rather than a lot of the yoga classes I’ve been to, the teacher just teaches the class, and I try to teach the individual students that I have in front of me.

LM: That’s awesome. Those birds are going crazy! I love it.

CM: They are!

LM: There must be a little nest or something over there. But that just seems like something that is really missing from a lot of areas or studios or things like that.

CM: It is, and yet I don’t think people know what it is they’re wishing for, so that’s the tricky part. To try to help people understand what I offer. I am really a fan of yoga philosophy too, because I think it really ties into better health and it suits a lot of people and a lot of people are a little shy about that too. They don’t know what it is. And it’s something that’s applicable to pretty much any lifestyle or belief system.

LM: And it can be really intimidating, because I know it’s like, if you feel like, well, you don’t know the moves or you don’t want to embarrass yourself, like, it can be intimidating, so it’s nice to have just more of an open and welcoming environment.

CM: Yes.

LM: Do you base your practice on any specific – and I’m not going to get the right terminology, but, style of yoga, or teaching…

CM: Yes and no. I really would say my classes are trauma-informed, so I’m very aware of what people might be triggered by, different populations, and the yoga therapy. So it’s Hatha yoga, which is pretty common, and I have learned a lot from Iyengar teachers and different practices. I teach yoga Nidra, which is yoga for sleep, it’s meditation. So I like to do a little guided meditation at the end of class to reset people. I really try to find a structure where people have the opportunity to get a little movement going and then calm themselves back down. Sometimes emotions come up in yoga and we don’t know what to do about it, and what I love about the practice is it’s really designed to calm the nervous system back down and regulate people so they have that ability rather than just walking out the door like you might if you get a massage, for instance, and something comes up and you’re feeling strange then you’re just kind of left to yourself, so I like that idea that it gives us a way to reset and kind of re-calibrate to be able to carry on with your day.

LM: There’s the upcoming Grand Valley Yoga Festival, I’ve noticed, that’s in a few weeks?

CM: Yes, it’s June 2nd to 4th, yes.

LM: OK. So how are you involved with that? Are you attending or teaching or both?

CM: I’m teaching dance, so it’s going to be a little different. They wanted a dance element. I have a friend that’s teaching some of the sound that’s going to be staying here while he’s here from Boulder and I am participating by leading dance. It will have a bit of a yoga element to it, because it’s a yoga festival, but I want to offer people a way to just get moving, to feel comfortable in their bodies, and express themselves, and just have some fun with it.

LM: Um, this is a totally random question but the sort of thing that I would worry about if I had never come to a class for yoga or for dance or whatever, would be, like what should I wear, you know? What should they wear if they’ve never come to a class before?

CM: Yeah, absolutely, good question. I think anything that feels comfortable to move in. Funny, when I was teaching veterans, I had a really hard time getting those guys not to come to class in jeans, which is kind of cumbersome, or can be inhibiting to your movement. So, maybe it’s all they have. You know, so you don’t want to be too picky about it. Definitely want to be open to people having it accessible.

I mean, accessibility is key. I know there’s a lot of specific yoga clothes out there, but really, you just need to be in something you can move your body in. And then thinking about temperature, if you’re outside especially. Do I want to bring a little jacket, just in case? Or, layering is always good. But something stretchy and movable. You don’t have to have fancy yoga clothes.

And we practice barefoot, so there’s no shoes involved, it’s pretty basic. I have props for people if they don’t have them, we have some at the community center, and for outdoor yoga, if people let me know I can bring things if they need them. So, if they don’t have a mat I can bring an extra mat with me.

LM: That’s awesome. So you mentioned though that you got into yoga because you wanted to improve your dance. So what kind of dance do you do, and do you still dance?

CM: I do, kind of! I gave up my troupe. I’m actually a belly dancer, so I studied belly dance for several years and I taught and had a troupe for 25 years on the front range. I was a little bit ready to let it go when I moved over here, and yet, once in awhile, I really miss it. I miss it a lot. What I miss about it the most I think is the way it can really enhance people’s lives and help them feel better about the body that they’re in. So I’m more interested in movement elements that enrich people’s lives and their feeling about themselves now than I am about stage presentation.

LM: Interesting difference.

CM: I do the Sing Up The Sun performance, and preferably I would have enough time to set it on the dancers and have them perform, not necessarily perform myself. I love performing, I’ve performed for years. I performed professionally, but I – I’m just not – I mean, I’m 63, and it’s not something that inspires me as much as, especially with women, having women really get comfortable in their skin, because that’s challenging in this culture. In many cultures.

LM: Yeah, absolutely. You mentioned the Sing Up The Sun festival, and I did see your performance there, along with the others, and it was so cool! So, I have to ask about the sword portion of the dance. What’s the significance of that?

CM: Well, the funny thing about belly dance, which is why I kind of like to fuse it with other dance forms, is that there’s so much of the history that’s missing, so it depends who you ask! For me, being a yoga person who is really interested in Hindi philosophy and deities, I like the concept of cutting away that which doesn’t serve. Clearing the space. Making room. So it’s not really a weapon, so much as it’s a, something to transform, to change, and to shift. And it’s fun. For me, I’ve always loved dancing with a sword. I love the props. But yes, as far as historically, it’s kind of hard to piece it together. You know, where did swords come in? They really came in when belly dancing moved more to the United States. They’re not something that’s maybe as indigenous to the culture. So, that’s true with several things. It’s changed so much over time.

LM: It’s super impressive to see. It’s like, everybody’s just sort of gasping, you know? Like, ah!

CM: I know. My little granddaughter – my son and his fiancee didn’t know that I was performing sword and they said, oh, she’s got her sword. And my granddaughter says, oh yeah, she does that. Because she dances with me over here and I’ll get the sword out because it’s kind of fun, she’s like, in awe. And, oh yeah, she does that!

LM: I have to ask a dumb question though – have you ever cut yourself with the sword?

CM: I cut someone else.

LM: Oh no!

CM: When I was performing. I’ve hit myself in the head with the little hilt, but, we were doing this piece and I was moving through space, and we were pretty close together, and I cut one of my dancer’s hands. And she kept going through the whole performance in spite of it and I didn’t even know. It was, and we still talk about it. It’s one of those things you don’t forget. I just hit her with the tip of the sword and cut her hand. So she was doing the dance and bleeding.

LM: Oh gosh!

CM: So, yeah. Little hazardous.

LM: Right, I had to ask that, because you have it, like, in your teeth and it’s like, ahh oh my gosh! It’s really cool though, the performance is really cool.

CM: I actually balance it on my chin. It looks like it’s in my mouth but I’m balancing it on the chin.

LM: Ah, it does! OK! Cool. How has teaching yoga and dance to others, how has that impacted your life?

CM: Oh, I think it’s saved my life, in so many ways. In my own experiences with trauma in my life and a lot of loss, and just a lot of different challenges that life has, it’s really helped motivate me. And I think in helping – I don’t even like the word helping, because I love to bring out what people already have inside. That’s why I feel I do more than helping them. They’re helping me. Because, for instance, teaching veterans was such a huge inspiration and really helped me face some of the challenges and learn more about challenges I might have when my son returned home from his tours. So I really feel it’s a gift to myself to bring yoga and dance to other people.

LM: When you do the therapy and working with others through yoga therapy, how do you let go of that trauma that other people kind of bring to you? Because I think personally, I would personally be terrible at that because I really hold on to the things, and you know, I wouldn’t know how to let it go. So how do you make sure it doesn’t weigh on you?

CM: That’s a great question, and it’s a constant challenge, you know, because I really try to draw my strength from source, so to speak, because I don’t really feel like a lot of my work comes from me – it comes through me. So, if I can really vitalize myself to begin with. Not take on too many clients. And sometimes it’s a little unavoidable. I do some grief circles online, I do women’s circles online, and quarterly they are grief circles, and I can leave circles sometimes just feeling shot for the day. I’m really wiped out.

So I have to remind myself to really build myself up and to not take things on. And it’s a constant challenge. That’s a really good question. I think that really maintaining a good diet and good health is useful. And once in awhile, it just sticks. It’s a little unavoidable. But for the most part, over time, I’ve gotten better and better at not absorbing what other people are feeling, because it’s not mine to have, you know? But it’s a challenge.

LM: I bet. I bet. When I was reading about your yoga therapy, or anyone who does any kind of therapy or grief counseling, or anything like that, I think that would be really challenging to make sure that you can be there for somebody and support them through what they’re going through, but also take care of yourself, so can help other people.

CM: Yeah, it is definitely a consideration. Different people take on more than other people, and I think it’s been really good for me to learn that too, because I can easily take on too much with my family. And so, how do we stay in our own lane? Yeah.

LM: Good thing to be aware of. But hard. Hard to keep that in mind.

CM: It is. It really is.

LM: So do you consider what you do to be a business you run or do you consider it something else?

CM: I consider it more of a business now. I work for the Giveback Yoga Foundation, too, and so I actually help distribute mats to a lot of under-served communities all over the country. So that ties in to my passion with yoga. And, yeah, I do try to keep it in a business scope. I teach at the Grand Valley Oncology, so I work with cancer patients there. And I do consider it a business, although not – I’m really not able to sustain myself with just that. So it is a constant challenge. I have to bring in other things to bring up my income level.

And there are so many people that offer yoga as more of a hobby and maybe for free. It’s really expensive to keep all my certification up and to continue with my training. So, that is something to consider too. In the work I do.

LM: Yeah, that’s interesting. The hobby vs. work distinction is pretty important.

CM: It is. And in a rural community, frankly, it’s a little less noticed when people have specific qualifications vs. in a place like coming from Boulder where it’s really expected. It’s just a different type of expectation, I think, from a teacher there than it is here.

LM: So, switching over to Palisade stuff, so you’ve been here, five years, you said?

CM: Yes.

LM: So, what’s your favorite part about the Palisade community?

CM: I love being in a small community. For instance, when I had covid, I had little gifts of food left at my door. I know all my neighbors. I feel this real welcoming presence in all of that that’s so different. I lived in a townhouse in Boulder, the last one I lived in, for 20 years and I didn’t know my neighbors the way I know them here. I like how accessible it is to hiking and different – you know, it’s just beautiful to be out in nature here. And so I love that about Palisade. And I feel like it keeps growing and changing, and it’s just fun to be in a small town.

LM: I know, the train. The train is in every episode. It’s unavoidable.

CM: It’s so loud for a couple seconds there. Then it kind of…

LM: I know. Do you sleep through it? Have you gotten used to it?

CM: I do. I think that, once in awhile, it might wake me up without me knowing that’s what it is, but I think for the most part I’m used to the sound. I mean really, if you live in Palisade, you hear a train.

LM: Yeah, you have to get used to it. I’m like surprised that I got used to it, because I’m a really light sleeper, and I do think that sometimes it does wake me up and I don’t realize it, but, for the most part, I don’t know how that happened!

CM: I know, it’s, and I forget sometimes to tell people, if they’re coming here to stay with me, like oh there is a train. And they’re like, well how loud is it? And it’s hard to gauge because we’re used to it.

LM: Yeah, anyway. But yeah, getting to know your neighbors – it is so different, because I do feel like people look at everybody here as a friend, as opposed to, even in Fort Collins, I knew who my neighbors were but you would sort of say hi quickly in passing, not really make eye contact, and just – it’s a totally different feeling.

CM: It is, and when I moved here, people were saying, you’ll get to know everybody in town. And I though, well, probably not, you know! And yet, in some ways, you do. And I certainly know most of the people in the neighborhood, and even a couple of blocks over. People I walk my dog with. Which is a really different feeling of community and connection that I didn’t have in Boulder. I would have to seek that more and here it’s kind of a natural.

LM: Completely. Do you have regulars who come back to your classes every – is it every week?

CM: It’s every week. Right now I’m teaching once a week. I might add on. Last summer I added because people really like to be outside. So I do, I have people that have been very consistent and some who kind of wiggle in and out. They’re here maybe once a month, or traveling different – you know, Palisade is that kind of a community where people travel a lot, come and go. There’s seasons that people are too busy here.

LM: Yeah, makes sense.

CM: It’s a really different season here that I don’t think people quite understand and that has taken me awhile to grasp. As far as when people are really available or not. It’s different here.

LM: Yeah, it’s interesting to get used to. I wasn’t expecting it to be so quiet over the winter, but I think after being here for a few years, we might come to appreciate that!

CM: Yeah, it is different, and it seems like – the first year I moved here, I took care of my granddaughter for the first year, pretty much full-time, while they worked. And then I surrendered her to daycare and started diving into my practice. Then covid hit. So it’s really been interesting to navigate through all that and set a course for myself that makes sense. Kind of coming out of that being really internal time.

LM: Right, right. Did you do teaching by Zoom or anything during that time?

CM: I did, and I still do. I was teaching Thursday nights at the community center and that shifted to online and it stayed online, partially because they ended up giving the space to someone else during that time slot and also because I can have, for instance, my mom, who is 92, comes to my Zoom class every week pretty much and my sister who’s in New Mexico, and some of my friends from the front range or students pop in. So it’s really expanded my practice, and I never thought I’d be comfortable teaching yoga online and I really like it. So, that changed.

LM: Do you do the moves along with everyone, or are you more observing and directing, or, not directing, guiding, I should say?

CM: I, yeah, it’s, that was tricky to navigate and I think one of the things I was resistant about. If I do a one on one with somebody, I’m really navigating them and going back and forth, but my class I’m pretty much demonstrating and know the students well enough, hopefully, that are participating that I can kind of give them cues and different ideas. But a lot of people, especially people with trauma, really need to watch while they do. It can be a little different than being guided if you really know what you’re doing in yoga. And I learned that especially with veterans. Veterans really need to be demonstrated to. And that’s a very generalized statement, but they need to have the visual as well as speaking. So I definitely am demonstrating the whole time online.

LM: Interesting. And that’s cool that it’s worked well and become its own thing now, post-covid.

CM: It has. It surprised me and I’m really happy to be open to it. I’m happy that other people have been. Some people aren’t – some people do not want to practice or participate online and other people prefer it. So. It’s nice to be able to be at home after your practice, especially at night. When I offer yoga Nidra sessions, which are meditation, it’s really nice to be able to leave people in their space and just let them be comfortable. They don’t have to get in a car and drive somewhere.

LM: Right, right, because the whole point is being relaxed and ready for sleeping. You don’t want to get in the car and then drive home and then be all stressed out!

CM: Right.

LM: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. It’s cool to have the different options to be able to offer. So when you get time off, what do you like to do?

CM: I like to travel. I love to go on river trips. My son’s a real river rat, and so I like to go with them. I like to spend time with my granddaughter, and I like to go over to Boulder and visit my friends there. I like to go to New Mexico and I love soaking in hot springs. But I work so many different places that it’s really challenging to get a chunk of time off. So I’m often more of a three or four day type of traveler.

LM: How do you keep track of all the scheduling of everything?

CM: I wake up in the morning and go, which day is this?! What am I doing today? It’s challenging. I have a Google calendar that I use. That’s really been important and yet each day of the week I might have specific things I do on that day and so I get kind of into my own routine with it. But it can be kind of strange, especially when I do extra workshops and things like that, just to keep it all scheduled and keep it straight.

LM: Yeah, it’s a lot!

CM: But it doesn’t get boring!

LM: Yeah I really rely on the Google calendar too, the reminders and everything.

CM: Yeah, if you’re going to different places each day and you don’t want to be thinking about it overnight or anything, just put it on the calendar and know that you can check it out if you don’t remember or have something unusual going on.

LM: So anything else about, that you want share about anything?

CM: Well I really do love my goddess circle offerings online and those are really fun to dive into some of the history and mythos, so to speak. And to notice how much it can apply to life now and doing a little dancing and writing and those, I would love to at some point maybe offer some small groups in Palisade. But I find that it’s easier to get enough people interested if I keep it online, because people can come from all over the place. And they’re small. They’re intimate. There’s a sense of confidentiality, so that people feel like they can come in and really share and participate without feeling that anything that comes up goes anywhere else. So that’s just something that really, I do them once a month, that I’m really fired up about. They always are really exciting. I do a lot of research and continuing education for those.

LM: You mentioned a lot of the things are still relevant today. Can you just give one example of something that recently surprised you?

CM: Well, I find it really fascinating that in the Hindi mythology, there’s a lot of reference to times like this, meaning times of natural discourse, so to speak, and how that relates to, for instance, how we treat the earth, which in mythology is going to be how we treat that goddess, for instance. And so we find that, in not taking care of the water and the source and the earth, so to speak the earth, but the air we breathe, that there’s repercussions, and that’s definitely part of the mythology. As well as different issues that women have throughout time are really resonant in different deities and what they offer and the support they give to just multiple, almost anything. There’s so many of them. It’s really fun and very fascinating to me. But it seems like whatever I pick seems to be really relevant for people in that time and place. You know, there’s very nurturing deities and there’s some that are really strong and like warriors. And the battle of the warriors is really about the battle of the human consciousness. Like we’re taking the swords and we’re taking the fighting and what we’re really fighting is ourselves. It’s very internal. And that doesn’t go away. That’s sustainable throughout time, that we have challenges and things to work through in life that are part of what life is about.

LM: That’s really interesting. Human nature.

CM: Yes!

LM: Well, I really appreciate your time. And so can you talk a little bit about the specifics of the class that you’re leading for the Grand Valley Yoga Fest?

CM: Well you can go to grandvalleyyogafest.com and it’s a very reasonably priced festival that has a lot to offer. A lot of different things. There’s music, there’s the dance, and my specific class is at 1:15 on Saturday, June 3rd, and it’s all held at the Palisade High School. So you can sign up for the entire weekend and sign up for specific classes. And there’s a lot. And other than that, what is my class called? I’m not even sure! I’ve just been calling it Dance with Christine.

LM: That might be what I’ve seen on Facebook too.

CM: Yes, yes. And the class itself, we’re going to go through some movement, some postures, and some basic movement. I’m always really careful about describing what we’re doing, culturally, because I’m teaching this philosophy and movement and dance, so to speak, from the Middle East, which has nothing to do with yoga, which is from a different area entirely and a different culture. And yet, so much of it goes hand in hand really nicely. So we’ll be doing some isolations. I’ll get the veils out, because they’re really fun to play with. It’s really easy to feel like dance is accessible when you have a veil as a dance partner and don’t have to think so much about your hands. And really I want to get people into how they feel, more than how they look, which is such an important part of movement to me. To really take that subtle movement and energy and enjoy ourselves. So that’s what we’re going to be doing, is just having some fun.

LM: And then regularly, normal classes and things like that, what’s the best way for people to see what you offer?

CM: The best way to see what I’m offering is either to go to Facebook or to my website which is kind of a long name, but it’s christinemooreshimmyogini.com. But even if you looked up Christine Moore in Palisade it would come up. And there’s so much on my website that people can probably find something that’s interesting to them if they’re at all drawn to yoga and dance. There’s just a lot there. And then there’s a contact page on the website so people can contact me that way. Can find me on Facebook too, with my name or just poking around, because I do try to put most of my offerings, at least the local ones, on the Palisade Business Board. I keep my classes listed regularly, and some of my workshops as well, but some of that, if it’s not here, I don’t feel like I want to spill over to that. We also have a Palisade Yoga and Dance Facebook page that the teachers that teach in town post in and I post in. So that’s another resource for people if they want an update. And it’s just called that: Yoga and Dance in Palisade.

LM: That’s one I don’t know about! Cool. Well, thank you so much for your time, I really appreciate. And I appreciate you reaching out awhile ago and just being interested in doing this.

CM: Yeah, thank you. I appreciate that you’re doing this and bringing more of what’s going on here to people. We don’t always know what’s happening in Palisade.

LM: I know, I know, and like I want to know! Thanks, I really appreciate it, Christine.

LM: A few days after I spoke with Christine, after a couple glasses of wine, I was thinking about how I haven’t danced for ages. Something about feeling older, stiffer, worrying more about how I looked than I felt. That distinction really struck me. So I put on my headphones, silent-disco-style, and danced around my kitchen like a maniac. It felt awesome. But I really hope that no one saw me. Thanks for the inspiration, Christine.

If you’re enjoying this podcast, let me know by leaving a rating or review on Apple Podcasts or a follow or rating on Spotify.

If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com.

The Postcards from Palisade podcast is available on all major podcast distribution platforms. Find us and subscribe now so you never miss an episode. Latest episodes and links to more information are also posted on the website postcardsfrompalisade.com.

Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.

E7: Dancing In My Head Photography – Lisa “Moose” Kral

Today I catch up with a fellow Lisa: Lisa “Moose” Kral of Dancing In My Head Photography. Lisa has been one of the photographers for Colorado Mountain Winefest for many years and will be returning as the Palisade Bluegrass and Roots Festival photographer in June. She’s also looking forward to returning as a photographer for the Palisade Peach Festival and lots of other local events.

Lisa may be best known for her ability to effortlessly capture Facebook-profile-worthy photos of people…along with her ardent love of the color purple. Lisa shares her path from desk job as an office manager to full-time photographer, the challenges of running her own creative business, how she and her husband Matt ended up in Palisade, her wildest celebrity and neighborhood encounters, and lots more.

For more info about Dancing In My Head Photography, find Lisa on Facebook or on Instagram @dancinginmyheadphotography.

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that shares a snapshot of the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Today I’m talking with Lisa “Moose” Kral of Dancing In My Head Photography. Lisa has been one of the photographers for Colorado Mountain Winefest for many years and will be returning as the Palisade Bluegrass and Roots Festival photographer in June. She’s also looking forward to returning as a photographer for the Palisade Peach Festival and lots of other local events.

Lisa may be best known for her ability to effortlessly capture Facebook-profile-worthy photos of people…along with her ardent love of the color purple. Lisa shares her path from desk job as an office manager to full-time photographer, the challenges of running her own creative business, how she and her husband Matt ended up in Palisade, her wildest celebrity and neighborhood encounters, and lots more.

Like her favorite kind of photo to take (clip), how she deals with un-credited photo sharing (clip), and what she loves about Palisade – from the heartwarming things (clip) to the kinds of wild adventures you might not see coming (clip). All that and more, on today’s Postcard From Palisade.

Lisa McNamara (LM): Do we really want the pickle song?
Lisa Kral (LK): Matt, do you wanna sing the pickle song? Just sing it real quick.
Matt Kral (MK): You talking to me?
LK: Yeah, sing the pickle song.
MK: Everybody’s pickling pickling pickling.
LK: That’s my introduction, folks. Welcome to the podcast about Dancing in my Head Photography!
LM: When you introduce yourself to somebody who doesn’t know you, how do you introduce yourself?
LK: Oh, just, I don’t pull out the Moose thing right away, I just say Lisa Kral.
LM: Would you rather ask people to call you Moose, or?
LK: No, I feel like people choose what they want to call me. My Mom refuses to call me Moose. There’s another woman in town who shall remain nameless, she does not accept Moose as my nickname. That’s totally fine. People who have known me a long time don’t often call me Moose. But they see it, and new people in my life usually pick it up.
The name of my business is Dancing In My Head Photography. I’m a photographer in Palisade, CO. That wasn’t exactly the plan when we moved out here, but it kind of happened, kind of organically. I feel lucky to be working with something that I love to do, instead of…my office management job was great and I was really good at it, but it didn’t bring me as much joy as photography does.
LM: So how did you end up in Palisade?
LK: So my husband and I met in 2003 and when we started dating we started going on a lot of road trips in Chicago. And we went like, everywhere, but like, small town. And we finally got really sick of driving through Indiana. Sorry, Indiana, if you’re listening!
LM: But it’s so fast!
LK: And we really, we took a trip to Breckenridge and we fell in love with it, and we just kept thinking, like, new road trips! We should just move to Colorado! And his job came with him, so it was really easy to make the transition to Denver. And when we got to Denver, we started road tripping everywhere, and Palisade was one of those places we just kept coming back to.
And we finally stayed at this B&B, it happened to be in Clifton, and it was for sale, and I fell in love with it. And we had just gotten married and then we started thinking about a house, and I wanted this B&B in Clifton. And we met with the Realtor and he’s like, you do not want that B&B in Clifton. So, he’s like, let me just show you a few more things, and he showed us, like, more than a few more things. And we saw this house – it was on the market for about a week, it was going to be in the parade of homes, and Matt and I were like – let’s move to Palisade! We kind of live our lives like that, we just, I mean, calculated risks, but you know.
So we ended up moving to Palisade and moving into one of our road trips, one of our vacations. Unfortunately, the only thing about Palisade is like, we don’t want to road trip as much, because we live in one! We’re like, living in our vacation, so it, you know, Palisade kind of changed our lifestyle, but in a good way, and we’re happy to be here. And we’ve been here for seven years now.
It was hard, I mean, our next door neighbor, who is no longer our neighbor, but she told me it would take me at least a few years to adjust. And it did. When we got here, I wanted to have the same exact job as I did in Denver, it was a great job. I was an office manager for a wealth management company, doing really well, treated very well, but I came here and it just, it wasn’t a necessary position that people were looking for. If anything, I did too much, and people were like, you’re going to get bored.
So, it did take me a few years to come into really accepting the photography thing as like, what I was going to really do, you know? And, now we’re happy, but those first few years were definitely a transition.
LM: Was it always a hobby for you, and nothing you thought of as a profession?
LK: Yeah, you know, even as a kid, I just documented everything I did. I remember my first big trip without my family was to Israel, and everybody I went with brought like one or two rolls of film. I was like, I need like 20 rolls of film! We’re going to be gone for weeks and I need to take pictures of everything! So, from then, and then my parents gave me a digital camera, and phew. Photos just, I mean, everywhere, everything! Close-ups, landscapes, just everything. And then I got into social media and started posting my photos and people are like, you need to sell these.
And so I started thinking more and more about just having this as a hobby, but then I had to, I wanted to brand it. And I was a dancer in college, a ballet and modern dancer. And I knew I wasn’t going to be dancing forever, physically, but I’m always – ideas are always dancing in my head. So that’s where that came from. It was really like, a no-brainier when I wanted to brand my business.
And we moved here and I met with the Chamber and I started working with the Chamber and covering more people. It was less landscapes from our road trips and more people of Palisade. That just kind of became something that people recognized about me – oh, you’re the person that took that awesome photo of me at Peach Festival. So I just started getting jobs, covering events. So now lately, it’s more people photos. Which I love, but it’s harder, because landscapes don’t complain. And some people do, but I think most of my clients have been happy.
LM: Yeah, landscapes don’t blink, either.
LK: Yeah. No blinks, no, you know, I don’t like this angle.
LM: Right, let me see it and let’s do it again!
LK: But, so far, I don’t think I’ve had any unhappy clients, at least not that they’ve told me! But, I love seeing my photos as people’s profile pictures. It just makes me happy. I like when I can make someone feel beautiful. It’s not always an easy thing to do. And I hate pictures of myself, so I get it! Please, people who I am taking your photo, I really get it! I know! But I, I see beauty. I will stare at a photo of someone for hours and hours and hours and they just get more beautiful to me. I see things that maybe they don’t see, other people don’t see, but I’m staring at them, you know, in this like frozen moment in time, and their beauty just comes out at me from the screen, and I love it.
LM: What’s your favorite kind of event or thing to photograph?
LK: I love festivals, because people are uninhibited. When you’re doing a head shot or even band photos, they want to portray a certain image. But at festivals, people are just having fun, and that’s what I like to – my favorite photo is just capturing someone’s happiness, and like I said before, joy. I think that’s the most rewarding thing for me, is just to capture that moment that someone else sees in a picture and they’re like, in that moment, you know? I’m digging the people photography right now!
LM: And I see if everywhere! You’re in all the magazines and on every website. When I was looking around to see if there were any other articles or anything written about you, it’s impossible to find anything because it’s like, photo credit: Dancing In My Head Photography, photo credit, that’s all that comes up, for like, pages!
LK: Right. Yeah, I mean, they did an interview for ShoutOut Colorado. It was pretty in-depth. I was very detailed, which I’m not always good at. My story is not like, super interesting. I’m just a delightful little person, floating around.
There’s random facts about me, like, I don’t know if I want to go into them. Like, sports is in my family, so my father and his brothers used to be part-owners of the Chicago White Sox. My mom’s cousin is the Dallas Cowboys announcer Brad Sham. My cousin Cory Provus was a baseball announcer for the Minnesota Twins. So there’s lots of sports and all these like, fun facts. Like when I used to go to baseball games as a kid, I’d meet like, Mr. T. I don’t know! I have all these weird, random stories that probably make me pretty interesting but no one really gets to know them because they’re like, I don’t know.
LM: OK, but what did Mr. T say to you?
LK: Oh gosh, I don’t even. I think he just told us how lovely we were. He was really nice. Here’s a funny story. My dad was a golfer in his younger days. But we used to go to Florida, because he loved to golf. And we went to this really beautiful country club, called Doral Country Club. And OJ Simpson was there. This was before, you know, the whole, OJ was the guy. But me and my friend were there and we met OJ Simpson, and he came up and my friend was swearing – she was a kind of rough-around-the-edges girl, we’re in our teens, and OJ Simpson told us that young, beautiful girls don’t swear. And you know, at the time, we’re like, oh, OJ Simpson just said that! But now, in retrospect, we’re like, OJ Simpson said that. You know?
LM: And if you keep swearing, I’m going to murder you!
LK: So you know, I have random fun facts.
LM: That’s hilarious. Oh man, I just got so sidetracked in my mind.
LK: I know, I did too.
LM: But no, it’s fun! OK, so we talked about how your favorite kind of thing to photograph is a festival. Do you feel anything when you line up a picture that you’re just like, this is perfect?
LK: Oh yeah! It’s like…like, everything inside you is just like is giddy like a kid and I can’t wait to get back to the computer and share it with everyone. You know, I know, like when I won’t have to edit or touch a picture, it’s like boom, done. It’s a great feeling. Because I don’t like editing. I’d rather just get the photo and move on. Editing is not the best part of the process.
LM: Do you spend more time editing than you actually spent photographing originally?
LK: Yeah. I mean, the more, see, I’m trying to get better at editing and just get fancier with it, and so the fancier, the more I know how to do with editing, the more time I’m spending. There’s something to be said for that, like being able to really accentuate a photo, but there’s also something to be said for getting it and not having to touch it.
LM: Yeah, because how do you know when you’re done? It’s just like with any art…any piece of art. How do you know when it’s over?
LK: It’s like a painting, yeah. Sometimes I just have to, you know, give it to the client and if it’s done – but it might not be done if they come back. I’m never finished until the client is 100% happy. But now, it’s funny, when I’m bored, I go back to old photos, before maybe even Dancing In My Head Photography was a thing, and I start re-editing those. Like, I could have made that better. And also I had a shhhh, I had a bad camera at the time. So. Don’t want you to have to bleep me!
LM: So far nobody has actually dropped any swearing on the podcast!
LK: Sorry, I could have been the first one! Ah!
LM: Jeff almost did, but then he censored himself!
LK: Just like I did?
LM: Yeah! I don’t know, I guess somehow this is turning into a clean podcast. Which is weird.
LK: Well you have a very wholesome voice.
LM: Hah!
LK: You do, I listen to your podcast and you just sound so, just, calm and peaceful. I can’t see anyone trying to be dropping swear words, like, left and right.
LM: Can you talk a little bit about what you’re working on right now? Or what you have coming up that you’re really excited about?
LK: Oof, I’m like, so, I’m working on a lot of things right now, I’m just like everywhere. Yesterday I took band photos so they’ll be my focus for, you know, until they’re happy. I have a Chamber photo event – actually, when’s this airing?
LM: If I can get it done for next Tuesday, I’ll do next Tuesday.
LK: Oh, well, it’ll be after. So, the community hospital grand opening is this weekend and I’ll be taking photos for the Palisade Chamber of Commerce. I have a friend’s wedding up and coming at Maison la Belle Vie this month. So just, you know, there’s a lot of little different things, some private photo sessions, and…I’m just everywhere this month.
LM: I’m sure it gets a lot busier as you get into festival season and wedding season!
LK: And better weather outside, people want to get photos. That’s Mellow [an adorable cat had just walked into the room].
LM: Hi Mellow! I love gray cats, especially. What’s your favorite camera to use?
LK: My favorite camera is my Sony A6500. I have tons of cameras. Believe me, my office is full of different cameras. But this one, I just, it’s always been reliable. I don’t know if it’s my lucky camera strap that I have on here.
LM: I love that strap.
LK: Yeah it’s just my go-to. I like it.
LM: It’s compact..
LK: It’s compact, yeah. I’m a tiny person. I have a giant camera and I feel like I’m walking hunched over – this is not good for my posture!
LM: Right!
LK: Yeah, I love my Sony A6500, as I almost drop it.
LM: What’s your dream camera to own?
LK: Oh gosh, I don’t know. I try not to even look at things, because then I get big eyes. And I don’t need a new camera right now. This one is very good to me. I don’t have a dream camera. I probably would if I looked.
LM: That’s very responsible!
LK: Yes, I know myself. I see something. I love clothes, too. Something weird that I do as a photographer is I try to have themed clothes for all my photos shoots. So like yesterday, when I photographed the band, I wore a shirt with a guitar on it. I have pants that have coffee on it for the Palisade Chamber’s Community Over Coffee, and like, we went to a wine festival and I have wine pants.
LM: I saw your wine pants, I was like, those are amazing!
LK: I have themed clothes, it’s weird. So, if I see the clothes, it’s the same thing about the camera. If I see it, I’m going to want it. So I know myself well enough.
LM: I’m impressed! That’s really good discipline.
LK: And that’s how we ended up with a purple car! I’ve had my other car for 20 years and this one, with all the high tech stuff, you know, my phone connects to the car now, so like I’ll be driving around Palisade and I’m getting texts, like, I just saw you in your purple car! And I’m like ah! Stop talking to me, car! Cars talking to me now! I might sound like an old lady, but, it’s just weird.
LM: You post a lot of your stuff online. And I know you watermark and everything.
LK: I’m getting better about the watermarking. People used to yell at me about not watermarking.
LM: I’ve asked you, oh, can I use one of your pictures, with credit and everything, but I’m sure that people use them, people share them. How do you feel about that, or how do you deal with un-credited sharing?
LK: Oh, it’s hard. I pick and choose my battles when it comes to that. I feel like some people should know better, you know? And it’s weird, because my feelings are not consistent. It’s very situational. But, in general, I don’t like people stealing my photos. But with the way things are these days, on social media, people can just right click and save it, you know!
LM: And you have no idea.
LK: Yeah. You don’t. For some reason, I feel like the Facebook algorithms are good to me. I’ll be scrolling and I’ll be like, oh! There’s my picture! Interesting. So, I’ve been able to catch a lot of it, just, I don’t know why, if the algorithm gods are being kind to me or what. It’s hard. It’s definitely hard when I see my photos somewhere where I wasn’t expecting them to be. I think a lot of people, in this day and age, who are in my circle – because I’m friends with a lot of photographers – they know. They know the unspoken rule. If you’re using someone else’s image, you ask. You give them photo credit. But, just for the record: photo credit doesn’t pay the bills.
LM: Totally! Yeah, no kidding.
LK: But like I said, it’s very situational. Like with the Sing Up The Sun festival – those are all my friends. You guys are all my friends. I’m not going to get mad at my friend for saying, you took this beautiful photo of me, can I use it? Like, of course you can!
LM: So if you do see something, do you try to –
LK: I usually say something. I try to be very polite. And usually the response is polite as well. It’s usually just an oversight or something.
LM: But this is a ton of labor and a ton of work and I think that people don’t necessarily see that. They see part of what you’re doing, which is being there and taking the picture, but, it’s your time, and then it’s your time later editing, and your skills, which are hard to quantify even. And there’s just so much more that goes into it.
LK: When I’m in editing mode, I come here, but I have a giant screen in there, so like I’m here, I’m there. I’m putting them through different editing programs, I’m looking at them, I look at them, I walk away, I’m not, I can’t just sit and stare, I need some perspective. It’s a whole, like, emotional process that I go through with the photos after I take them. That luckily only my husband has to see.
But yeah, I will shut down, for like a few days, if it’s a big event and there are thousands of photos. Not to toot my own horn, but I usually like a lot of those thousands of photos! So then I have to like, be more discerning. I think that’s probably my biggest flaw, is being more discerning. Because I usually fall in love with a lot of the photos that I take and it’s like, even if the band member may be just slightly different here, but they’re both good pictures! But yeah, the editing process is something that I think is definitely under-appreciated.
LM: Absolutely. Absolutely. In terms of owning your own business, especially a creative business, what do you find most rewarding about that and what’s the most challenging thing about it?
LK: Well, the photography business, since there’s no scheduled hours – I used to be very routine, when I had an office job. Wake up at the same time, shower at the same time. Everything was, and now I don’t have a routine, which is very hard, and it’s hard on him too. So, that’s the hard part, I don’t have a very steady routine. You never know when you’re needed and I try to be available at all hours. Except the morning. You have to pay me extra to be like, up in the morning and ready. Photo gigs in the morning cost extra!
The most rewarding though is I can do what I want! Not that I say no to anybody, but I can choose what I want to do. Being an office manager, at a high demanding job, I couldn’t say no. I did everything. I was the IT girl, I was answering phones, ordering things for the office, preparing nice-looking presentations, and taking care of clients. It was just everything. I had to do everything, and it wasn’t always my choice. But I think it’s very much my choice, which I love about having my own business.
LM: What’s your favorite thing about the Palisade community?
LK: Oof, um, it’s funny, because after living in big cities for most of my adult life – we had our certain friends, and small, but you move to Palisade and you feel like you’re friends with everybody. And I love it. Growing up, I had like four guy friends, four or five guy friends, and those were my boys. And I kind of stayed, throughout my whole life, most of my friends have been guys, until I moved to Palisade. I have a lot more female friends here. I feel like, better about that! I used to get, like, panic attacks when I had to be in a room with a lot of women. But now I don’t feel that at all. I like it. I felt very welcomed here. It’s hard sometimes if you want to just roll out to the grocery store, but now with my purple car there’s no going to the grocery store and like, not seeing anybody!
LM: You can’t go incognito anymore!
LK: Matt’s like, you’re not going to know anybody here, and we walk in and I was like, hi. I already know someone here.
LM: You’ll have to go to some grocery store on the other side of town, but you’ll still probably see somebody you know!
LK: But even there – yep, yep. I mean, with the purple hair and now with the purple car, it’s really hard to be incognito. But I love it. I really like it. It’s a very warm community. I mean, I’m a city girl, so I have great stories now. Our neighbors used to have pigs that got loose. Matt and I have chased loose pigs, like, three times, I think. And just like, these stories that I get to say, these words coming out of my mouth. Like, there were pigs rolling around on our pool cover once. And they were over 200 pounds. And they’re like, you know, during the season the pool cover collects rainwater and stuff. The pigs got out and I’m looking out this window and there’s just a pig rolling around and I’m like, and Matt’s, I call Matt and I’m like, I don’t know what to do!
And luckily the pool covers can hold up a lot of weight. I mean, I’ve stood on it before, it’s like a water bed almost. But, I was like, Matt, what do I do, the pigs are on the pool! And there were two others, like, looking at it. So Matt comes out and I’m like, oh the photographer in me, I have to record this. So Matt goes out and he’s like, herding them away from the pool and I have it on video. Sorry, this is a podcast and you can’t see it, but it’s like, a really funny video.
LM: I can visualize it, trying to grab the – or were you just trying to herd them?
LK: They were so big. So, one time they got little babies. This was the third time that they got pigs. They thought they had secured the, but they were so tiny that the little pigs got out, and those were the only pigs you could actually pick up and carry. Of course I have pictures of that too. But the other ones, the ones on our pool cover, there was no picking those guys up. They ended up being over 250 pounds, so what we had to do, was like, everybody had to grab something. Like a stick, a rake, our pool skimmer, whatever it was, and you have to, like – you need at least four people to kind of corner them off and like kind of run them back to the pen.
And luckily one time when they got out, some guy was just driving down the highway and he pulled over and his dog was a herder. Because the neighbors weren’t home and it was just me and Matt and we’re like, trying to get these giant pigs. And this guy comes out and like finally the neighbors get home or their friends come over and so the herder dog saved the day. So, wrangling pigs. That’s another thing I love about Palisade – I get to tell stories like that. Mom, I wrangled pigs today!
LM: I’m pretty sure that wouldn’t have ever happened in Chicago.
LK: Not really, and not Denver either! Not something I ever imagined myself saying, but love that I have these stories. And you know, even just simpler things. I never thought we’d have a peach orchard. We have 130 trees, about. Maybe a few less, because we’ve lost some over the years, but Dennis Clark takes care of our peach orchard and we couldn’t be more thankful.
The first year we were here it was a great season, and we didn’t really know, we were still getting to know the situation the previous owners had with Dennis, and we woke up to like, boxes, giant boxes of peaches. It was a very good season. Every day for like three days we’d just get giant boxes of peaches. And Dennis sells them at Clark Family Orchards. We just run the irrigation and they take care of the rest. And we’re very thankful. So even things like that, you know. The things I get to say about my Palisade life, which has been my hashtag since I got here. I just, I love the things. And they bring smiles to my face and to other people’s face when I tell them. So, it’s just like a good life here. My Palisade life is really enjoyable.
LM: So when you get a day off, how do you enjoy it?
LK: When I get a day off, I – I mean, everybody thinks I’m like, this super social person – and I am, but I lately, especially, I just like retreating, just being by myself. You know, it’s funny – he works from home, and I enjoy like, listening to him on his phone calls. I like it. He says things that warm my heart. I’m like, that’s my husband! You know, I just –
LM: Oh no, Paul’s going to be so jealous, I always say, you’re so loud!
LK: Well, I will say, he used to sit out here and work and I’d be like, dude, you’re in the middle of our house. Like, you gotta take it into your office. You got one. But there are times when I’ll be editing photos over here and he’ll be working next to me, and it’s kinda nice. Like I said, a lot more lately, when I’m not working I just want to kind of have some down time. Just peaceful, quiet. You can see I – I can just sit outside or take pictures around my property.
I really never stop taking pictures. Even if I’m home, I’m like, ooh, that tree looks pretty, ooh there’s a pretty, you know, so, it’s just me time, when I’m not working. And I actually don’t have the best memory. So photos actually really help. Like we were just, last night, we were like reminiscing about all the houses we looked at when we were moving – I don’t remember, and this was only eight years ago – but I don’t remember any of the houses except this one. He’s like, don’t you remember, it had the weird – and I’m like, no. I don’t even remember being there. So photos help me remember certain things.
And also, like, it’s funny cause I feel like I see the world in like, super vivid colors. And then I always, that’s why, like, when I edit some photos, I get carried away. Because when I see things, everything seems, like, much more vivid. And I know cameras don’t always capture the true essence of colors, but, I just love making things really bright and vivid and colorful. I do that even when I’m alone, you know? Like I said, I work on old photos sometimes, and just because I think, like, oh I didn’t really capture what I really saw. So yeah, I have fun by myself. I’m really good at being alone. I really don’t mind it at all. And you know, he’s a hoot. He’s always good for a laugh. And entertaining.
LM: That’s good. Good to like your husband! Is there anything else that you want to share? Anything that I didn’t ask you?
LK: Well, I’m really glad that you didn’t ask me about my nickname and where it came from, because that’s a story best told at other times.
LM: Part of the problem is that I already read the story!
LK: Yeah, if you don’t know the story, too bad!
LM: Yeah!
LK: Just kidding. Come and find me and I’ll tell it to you. I guess, I want people to know that I love taking photographs of anything and everything and I’d love to help out. If you’re struggling to see beauty in yourself, I’d love to help you find it. I think that’s what’s been motivating me a lot, lately, is helping people see what I see, that beauty is in anyone, anywhere. So just know that I photograph anything and everything. I used to say, I only do this – but now, there is nothing I won’t do. I really hope people in Palisade and beyond, whoever is listening this, will consider to hire me. I’d love to work with you. Is that like, a good shameless promotion?
LM: Yeah!! That’s an excellent shameless promotion!
LK: I work with many budgets and all kinds of things. So yeah. Reach out to me.
LM: How would people get in touch with you? What’s the best way?
LK: Um, you can’t. No, just kidding. You can email me, my email is lisagkral@gmail.com. You can find me on Facebook at Lisa Moose Levy Kral or Dancing In My Head Photography. I have a website that I don’t like, so I don’t want to steer you there, but it’s another way to find me. It’s dancinginmyhead.com. I have someone who wants to help me with my website, and I know she will. Hannah, I know you’re listening, maybe. And I will ask you to help me, eventually. I’m on Instagram – dancinginmyheadphotography. So, I’m easy to find. I’m also that girl with the purple hair, so.
LM: And the purple car! Thank you so much for your time. This was super fun.
LK: Yeah, thanks. It was nice for you to get to know me. If anyone has any questions for me, I’m happy to talk, and spend quality time. And maybe I won’t take your picture, we can just talk.
LM: Sounds good. Awesome. Thank you, Lisa.
LK: Yeah, thank you.
LM: Something that Lisa says is: you can’t spell Palisade without Lisa. Just look, it’s right there in the middle. And you’ll never unsee it now.
If you’re enjoying this podcast, let me know by leaving a rating or review on Apple Podcasts or a follow or rating on Spotify. If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com. The Postcards from Palisade podcast is available on all major podcast distribution platforms. Find us and subscribe now so you never miss an episode. Latest episodes and links to more information are also posted on the website postcardsfrompalisade.com. Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.

E6: Spoke and Vine Motel and Fidel’s – Jody Corey and Jeff Snook

Jody Corey and Jeff Snook own and operate the Spoke & Vine Motel and Fidel’s, a cocina and bar in central Palisade. Jody and Jeff bought the old Mesa View Motel, remodeled it, and opened as the Spoke & Vine Motel in 2019. And then they very unexpectedly became restaurant owners when they bought the old Palisade Café and Wine Bar on two weeks’ notice, renovating that space into what is now Fidel’s. We talked about how they navigated both projects – relying on each other and the community for support, about the biggest surprises they encountered along the way, their favorite things about Palisade, and lots more.

For more info about the Spoke & Vine Motel and Fidel’s, check out their websites: fidelspalisade.com and spokeandvinemotel.com.

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that’s all about the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Today I’m talking with Jody Corey and Jeff Snook. Jody and Jeff own and operate the Spoke & Vine Motel and Fidel’s, a cocina and bar in central Palisade.

Jody and Jeff bought the old Mesa View Motel, remodeled it, and opened as the Spoke & Vine Motel in 2019. I caught up with them on their equivalent of a Friday afternoon after a busy weekend and we shared some laughs and great conversation.

They shared my favorite kind of construction budget story: (clip), We talked about how they adjusted to motel ownership life: (clip), And about how they very unexpectedly became restaurant owners when the old Palisade Cafe and Wine Bar suddenly went up for sale: (clip). Keep listening to find out what I asked Jeff that surprised him: (clip)

All that and more, on today’s Postcard From Palisade.

Jody Corey (JC): I’m Jody Corey.

Jeff Snook (JS): I’m Jeff Snook, Jody’s husband.

Lisa McNamara (LM): We could probably spend two hours talking about everything you do, but when you introduce yourselves to somebody, what do you say you do?

JS: Uh…

JC: We usually sigh!

JS: Yeah, we usually take a break, like a, kind of really think about exactly what we do.

JC: What is our purpose here.

JS: Yeah, what’s our purpose in life?! I think the first thing that I say is, hi my name’s Jeff. I usually don’t ever say my last name, I don’t know why, but, I say, hi my name’s Jeff. My wife and I own and operate a restaurant and a motel in Palisade. And yeah, that’s about it.

JC: I usually add that I dabble in real estate and consulting. Interior design. Whatever you want, we can take care of.

JS: That’s right.

LM: So I read the story on your website about Spoke and Vine – the origin story, the myth, the legend. Can you talk a little bit about that – like, why did you decide to buy a motel?

JC: So, I was in Steamboat for twenty years in total and throughout my time there, I worked for a real estate developer, I had an interior design business, and then a property management business. And with that background, I started reading about a lot of motels going through a renaissance period. Where people were once again interested in them. Most of them were built in the fifties and earlier, and I think they have some inherent interesting qualities as far as the architecture is concerned. So I started reading articles about people renovating these old motels and making them into – refreshing them and making them into something new and attractive and desirable again. And that was just really interesting to me.

However, we were in Steamboat, and there was a motel for sale up there and it was just way expensive and it was just a story that kind of kept playing in my head. That I really like taking something old and turning it into, breathing some new life into it.

So fast forward, I came on a girls trip and a girlfriend of mine, she had a bachelorette party here, and she talked about Palisade every time I saw her. She just loves Palisade. So for her birthday, we came down here, four girls, and we stayed at the Mesa View Motel. And we stayed there because there really were no other lodging options in Palisade. So we stayed there and we checked in and we were, we were a little nervous, to put it lightly. We checked in super late, like I think it was quarter to eleven at night. And the lobby experience was very – a bit sketchy, and then the room was not much better than that. And so we checked out the next day. And the girls went out for drinks that night, and I was like, you know what, Palisade is darling. We went wine tasting, we took our road bikes through the monument, we had a great time. I’m like – we should buy that place! And they were like – what are you talking about?

JS: Granted, Jody and I, we were married at this time. We are together, we were together. So go ahead.

JC: So, so anyway.

JS: So she asked the girls about buying a motel before she even talks to me. This is just how life goes.

JC: But anyway, this is how, this is how the idea…

JS: This is how Jody goes!

JC: This is how the ideas get created! So, anyway…

JS: So anyway!

JC: I sent a friend a message who lives is Palisade, I said, what do you know about the Mesa View Motel? That night. So she responded, she didn’t know much, whatever. And a few months later, it got listed and her name is Jen Sliney, she used to live here for years, she texted me and she says, the motel is for sale. And this was, I want to say now it’s probably December. So I was in property management, Jeff was the GM of a restaurant…

JS: That was like, October/November, because I had just started as a – oh no, excuse me, it was in like, May/June, because I had just started at Salt and Lime.

JC: No that, so anyway, we were getting into our tourist season. And Jeff’s like, shut up, you don’t, this is the last thing we need to be worried about. And so that spring, we came down in May, and we did the, it was this race, called the Gran Fondo, put on by Jen Sliney. We came down with a bunch of friends and our campers and we stayed at Base Camp. And it was a beautiful weekend, we did this beautiful bike ride, went to the distillery, we did all the things, rode around on our bikes and our cruisers, and we had a great weekend. And on the way out of town, I’m like Jeff, just, just do me a favor, let’s just drive by, the camper’s hooked up, we’re ready to get on the highway, he u-turns it. And we drive by the old Mesa View Motel. We drive by, there’s like people hanging out, all the doors are open, it, you know, if anybody lived in Palisade they know what I’m talking about. It just was not visually appealing. And Jeff was like, what are you, nuts? There definitely was a curse word in there somewhere.

JS: Yeah, I was like what the f– do you want to do with this place? What are you, nuts?

JC: The trip back to Steamboat is three hours. I had three hours to convince Jeff that this was a great idea. By the time we rolled into Steamboat…

JS: And those were my words, I said, you have three hours to convince me about this. I was like, and once we’re home, we’re home.

JC: And then by the time we got to Steamboat, we already had a trip booked that following weekend, lined up, we were going to go see the place.

JS: Yeah.

JC: Because it was still for sale. And we stayed at the…

JS: And we stayed at the Wine Country Inn for like two night. We brought our cruiser bikes, we like, checked it out. It was cool.

JC: We kicked the tires on the town. And we’re like, you know what? This is a town that we can see ourselves in.

LM: What was your objection to it originally?

JS: Uh, living in Steamboat. Disrupting our life. I had just started a job at a restaurant, Salt and Lime, I was a GM, and I was like, this is my dream job. Well, not my dream job, but a job that I want. You know, I was still very much invested in it and I had committed to them. I was like, if we do this, we have to drop everything. I’m going to be the one that has to leave. So I was like, I don’t really want to do that. And then she started selling it, and then she started talking about it, building it up. And then we came down here and it was like, OK, let’s put an offer in!

And they were asking an exorbitant amount of money for it, which they didn’t get. And, you know, we just spent that summer kind of doing the due-diligence. So I came back and forth from Steamboat to meet with the previous owners and plumbers and electricians and pest and everything you could think of. I mean, kicked the tires hard on it.

JC: And then we still had some surprises!

JS: Yeah, still do!

LM: You totally remodeled it, right?

JS: Yeah, it was interesting.

LM: What was the biggest surprise that you found?

JS: Biggest surprise? I mean…

JC: I think I would – I would like to say probably the volume of mold. The volume of mold on pipes that went…

JS: On interior walls…

JC: I think actually the biggest surprise was, we ripped, I don’t know, 85% of the place out. All the plumbing underneath the building. Even the drywall.

JS: All new electrical, all new plumbing.

JC: Some new studs. Like, we had to re-frame a lot of walls, including exterior walls.

JS: Ugh…

JC: But, the biggest surprise to me, as somebody that is in interior design and construction, when we went to rip out one of the rooms, it was linoleum, linoleum, carpet, then carpet! And I don’t know how much money you’re saving by laying carpet over old carpet! That just doesn’t even make sense.

JS: Well, the labor of pulling it out, the new foam backing…it’s a lot of money.

JC: I guess. We lost a quarter inch on just pulling it out – or, gained a quarter inch in ceiling height! So yeah, that was probably the biggest shock to me.

JS: Yeah, I think the biggest shock was the rot on floors that you would never see unless you tore the place apart. And obviously we were told there were never any leaks. And the amount of mold. And the amount of money…

LM: Yeah, in a dry climate, that is just not expected.

JS: Yeah, right, well the budget just jumped, exorbitantly.

JC: Yeah, our construction budget was a bit of a…you know…it was…

JS: A moving target.

JC: Totally a moving target. And we did a lot of the work ourselves. But what we, what helped was, we’re a husband and wife team, and the days Jeff was low, I was there being the cheerleader. And the days I was super low, he was the cheerleader. And luckily they didn’t happen – we weren’t both in the lows. Not frequently.

JS: Not frequently. Sometimes.

JC: Sometimes! But I think what we kept saying as like our mantra, like, we’re just doing this once. When it was an option to do it right or half-ass it, it was like, we’re just doing it once, we’re going to do it right. So, but we did take some extra time and spend some extra money to make sure that this motel can last another hundred years. That was important to us.

JS: Yeah.

LM: And did you do all the interior design and graphic design?

JC: I did the interior design. The graphic design we used a great friend of mine who I’ve been working with for years. She did the website, she had a great branding team, graphic designer.

JS: Tall Poppies?

JC: Yep, Tall Poppies. And then Jeff, he did, he GC-ed the project. We painted half of the exterior ourselves. Jeff, I don’t know, you…

JS: I don’t even remember what I did. I was, you know, I worked next to – we hired a carpenter who built the walls and I was just basically his assistant. I was the grunt. I swept up every day, I brought the wood in, I brought the flooring in, like I had everything essentially ready for the contractors to come in and do their thing and save on them having to babysit it and running around in circles. They needed an extra pack of whatever – paint? I’m going to go get it, you keep working.

JC: We built all the furniture ourselves, whether we ordered it. Seventeen vanities.

JS: Seventeen vanities, out of IKEA! Late nights at the motel by myself! And granted, I don’t know, that a lot of people probably don’t know this, but Jody was still living in Steamboat for the first year. While the motel was open. So I lived here by myself in a camper for the first two months in the parking lot of a shady motel.

JC: In the winter, with terrible heat!

JS: That I knew nothing about the town, so I’m like, waiting to get murdered, abducted, whatever.

JC: And really, not many people came over. Our first friend, for a long time, first and only friend, was Bennett Price. He’s a legend, we can’t say enough about him and Davy across the street at De Beque Winery, but they were, they welcomed us like family.

JS: Yeah. Also, Riley Parker was pretty cool.

JC: And Riley Parker.

JS: Riley kind of lives kind of catty corner to the west of us across the frontage road, man. And he would always – he’d see me out there, he’d always pull up. He’d introduce himself and from that point on it was, hey Jeff, how’s it going? You’re looking good man, you’re always working! And I was just like, thanks! They were just, they were cool, they were supportive. Because they both essentially live across the street from what used to be the Mesa View and it was an eyesore. So they saw the potential as well. So it was nice to kind of get the kudos from like, you know, the locals. It was cool.

LM: They were probably happy about what you were doing and glad you were here.

JS: And we didn’t know.

JC: Yeah, there was probably some nervousness from some people, like, what’s going on, here we go again. Waiting back and see what they see and allow us to do what we do. Which was great.

LM: I talked to Cody last week, from The Homestead, and one of my questions for her was a similar thing, what inspired you to buy a hotel and take this project on? And she said it was really seeing what you guys did and seeing the positive transformation of something that had been a really big part of Palisade and a visible part, and seeing it turned into something beautiful and productive and useful and that really inspired her to take on that project herself. And so I was curious what, like what does that mean to you, that you are now inspiring other people here?

JS: I mean, I think that’s the biggest compliment you can get, you know.

JC: Yeah, for sure.

JS: And their property is amazing. Like, and they’re amazing people. So it was kind of like – because we went down there for their grand opening. It was really cool to walk in and be like, this is what people probably felt like walking into our property when we were doing it. So kind of, to be on the other side of it, to kind of seeing what someone else was doing. Regardless of us doing it. But just to know what that property was and to walk into what it is now, is like, whoa. Nice work!

JC: And also know that there are blood, sweat, and tears. They went through all the emotions just as we did.

JS: Yeah. I’ve talked to him twice now, commiserated about something very similar now that we’re both open. And we’re just like, you too, huh? And we’re like yeah, OK, cool.

JC: Cody reached out to me a few months ago and introduced herself and we had coffee and I shared as much as I can with her to help her be successful and share the lessons that I’ve learned and hopefully, it’ll help them out. I’m sure they have their own lessons to learn as well. But we have a really good relationship with them and we’re really proud of them. And we went through it and there’s no reason to hold onto it. We all want the same thing for us, our families, for Palisade, for the community, for our guests. It’s an opportunity to show off why we live here in this beautiful place. And we’re attracting really cool tourists that are quote unquote getting it. Getting why Palisade is so very special. So yeah, it’s been fun to have them in the lodging community here in Palisade.

LM: Any flashbacks when you went to the open house?

JS: Absolutely!

JC: They were telling their stories and we were like, oh yep! We were there, we built tons of furniture too, you know, whatever it was. A lot of people ask about the motel renovation and they think it’s like, this glamorous thing. It wasn’t!

JS: No! I have a lot of pictures to prove it!

JC: You know, our lifestyle is not particularly glamorous. We have to have the phone on our nightstand. We have to be ready to drop plans, run in, and pitch in. I think it’s important. And we do run a business where we are ever-present, for better or for worse. We are always there to pitch in when it’s busy. We’re always there to take out the trash. We are never too proud. And that’s the kind of business I grew up in, in a family business that the owner has to do all of those things. And if you’re not prepared to do all those things, how can you expect your employees to do it? And in small business, we all have to touch every thing, you know? Everybody has to be able to help all the other parts of the operation for the ultimate success of everybody. It’s important.

LM: It really does feel like an extension of your home too, because you have the Motel Bar and then the outdoor patio. When we hang out there, it’s like you invite locals to hang out there and you also invite your guests in, but it also feels like it’s partly like that because you spend so much time there and it’s a homey environment.

JS: Well, we live there!

JC: It was our home!

JS: The bar was my home! Our home, excuse me. It was my home for the first year.

JC: It was the living room.

JS: Yeah, the bar was our living room. We literally, like, when we finally had the wood floors done and we could move in, we didn’t have any furniture and we just put the queen bed mattress right in the living room where the ice machine was right now. And it wasn’t open, obviously you couldn’t see into the lobby, but that double, that weird double door was there, you know? So you look back at it, and that’s, I think, outside from the mold, you asked that question earlier, like, I thought it was so weird that I was living in a motel.

JC: It was so weird that we were living in a motel! So everybody…

JS: A motel that we own, which was also weird! Because I never thought that was going to happen.

JC: Everybody that knows me knows that I’m from New York City. So, so, when we first opened the motel, people would be driving in, late night, and I’m out the window like, who’s in the driveway?! Like I just had that visceral reaction, like, someone’s coming in unannounced. And Jeff’s like, we own a motel! And I’m like oh right, right! OK, OK!

JS: They want to pay us money to stay here! For what we just did!

JC: OK, OK, we gotta get with it. Or you’re coming with your groceries and you know, the next thing you know, the guests are asking for directions…

JS: It’s July and the ice cream is literally dripping on the concrete because they want to talk about wineries. And I’m like, OK, I’ll do this! That’s what we do!

JC: Right, because we generally are helpful. That’s what we do. So, because we lived there, that was our only outdoor space. It’s not as if we hung out in the back alley – we had our family barbecues out there. So when we had people over or we’d just want to go out and drink coffee in the morning or go have a glass of wine, our guests were out and about.

Honestly, that was the best situation as far as market research. Our guests told us so much about what they enjoyed in Palisade, where they came from, what do they expect on vacations. We really got – we came away from those years with friends. Our motel guests became friends and there were many nights when you’d see us around town with, you know, the guests from number nine.

JS: We still hang out, we still – when people come to town, we still go out to dinner with them. From when they first stayed with us. Yeah, like Landon and Sarah. Cool people. It’s really cool.

JC: And that’s – when we built the motel, we were talking about, what is the identity, what kind of place do we want to build. It came from building a business that suits our personality and it has worked out because we have attracted people we generally connect with. We wanted it to be more than just a place to sleep. We wanted it to feel like a home away from home. That they were part of the Palisade community.

LM: And you’re building community around the motel as well, with bike nights and things like that. Can you talk a little bit about how you started that?

JS: It started with covid. Really. I mean, covid happened, and it was our first year. Our one year anniversary was May 1st of ‘20. Covid hit. And Jody had just moved to Palisade that February. So, very thankful for that. The motel was dead. We were scared, obviously. But then, we started to meet the community. This is when we really started to like, see Palisade people, because, you know, nobody else was here.

JC: And we had time!

JS: And we had time. So you know, people would be cruising around, talking, hanging out, whatever, and we were like, we’re outside, let’s do a cruiser ride. Let’s go cruise around town, come back, and then have a couple drinks. And it just kind of started happening from there. And then, I don’t even know how Pali Thai started. I think it was just kind of – hey, we should get a food truck!

JC: Yeah Mark, Mark from Pedicab…

JS: Oh, that’s what it was. We finally moved out of the motel and we has this space, and I was like, Jody we gotta do something with this space – let’s build a bar! And she was like, you want to build a bar? And I’m like, yeah, let’s build a bar! So we built a bar. Got a liquor license, did all the jazz. And then, then it started to really progress. Like oh, let’s go for a cruiser ride, get people to come to the bar and buy some drinks. Kept it reasonable. And then like, oh, let’s get a food truck. Like Pali Thai. A few other people. And then it really, Pali Thai just committed and they’re like, Monday nights are yours. And it was like, locals night. Just kind of started turning into something really cool. And it ebbs and flows like it does, but ultimately, everybody talks about it in the winter – like, alright, when are we gonna start this up?

JC: I mean, when we moved to town – Steamboat is a very special community and we had great friends up there, and a lot of the people in Steamboat are transplants, so many of us didn’t have family, and so your friends become your family. And so when we moved down here, we felt like we lost our family. And it was difficult for us, and again, we were working a bunch, to meet other locals. So we wanted to, selfishly, create a community for ourselves. And we thought this would be a good way to get people together, and for other people sort of like us that are looking to meet some other new friends to come and establish some relationships. So, it really has helped. And I know, like, going to the Monday night events, there are so many friends that are sitting together that didn’t know each other months ago. And now they, now they’re making plans outside of the Monday night.

JS: I think it’s still the Facebook page picture, of the original group, and we’re all like, oh, we should probably be wearing a mask. Like I think I have a mask on, and a few other people and we’re kind of spread out a little bit. So it’s kind of cool that that’s where it came from. It’s like, one of the positives from covid for us. Because, you know, covid was a negative for the motel for the first three, four months. It was really tough. And this was one thing that came out of it and it’s still happening three years later.

LM: I can’t even tell you how meaningful it was for Paul and me when we moved here. It was kind of the thing that made us say, we want to stay here.

JS: Oh cool.

LM: Because we didn’t intentionally move here originally. We just were looking for a place to buy and just needed an apartment, and this was the best one we saw, in Palisade, and then we started going on the rides and meeting people and I was like, wait, we just stumbled onto this community and this is exactly what I want. We’re going to stay here. So I think, for us, that was like, the biggest thing, in getting us into this community and just wanting to be part of it. So we really appreciate it.

JC: Oh that’s so cool, I didn’t know that.

JS: That’s awesome. And you know, Jody said earlier and I want to reiterate, Mark from Pedicab, he was right there. It was, it was probably more of his idea and we just had the space, so we offered that space up and it kind of all came together with it and it just developed. And it was cool to have Mark around for that – he’s still around today, but, he’s a cool dude.

JC: There really are a lot of cool people just rallying the community. The amount of things, like, at this point it’s kind of hard to pick what you’re going to go to, we have so many fun events and gatherings and…

JS: Right, we just had the Bluegrass Bash! It’s free music for people.

LM: For four days! Four nights!

JS: Right?! Four days of festival. People pay hundreds of dollars for that. It’s free in Palisade. Like, that’s cool.

LM: I guess before we move on to Fidel’s is there anything else about Spoke and Vine that you want to share, any other stories?

JS: I think Spoke and Vine is just a cool property. It’s important to us because it’s our baby. It’s the first thing we did together, as a couple. She was a business owner and I worked for other people. This was our first business together and we developed it together. Her idea and my sweat. Back and forth. I committed something to it!

JC: Wow, wow!

JS: It’s true! I still have the scars to prove it. You should see my lungs. But no, it’s a special property for us. I think. I think it’s special.

JC: Yeah.

JS: And we’re, we have a great staff over there right now, and they’re pretty much running it. Which is allowing us, which allowed us, to slide into the restaurant industry. Which we never thought we were going to do, being that we had worked in it before. We’re like, we’re not going to run a restaurant. Are you nuts? And so, maybe that’s a good transition into Fidel’s?!

LM: Yeah! It’s a great transition. So Fidel’s, when I first came here as a tourist, it was the Palisade…

JS: Cafe! And wine bar.

LM: What made you say, you know what, we’re going to take this on?

JS: (long inhale) Again, pausing with the question, that’s what we do. We heard about it. And, we, I don’t know, um, go ahead, you go. I’m stumbling for words right now. OK. Here we go! Here comes my Queens girl! Queens is out!

JC: So we were at the Monday night cruiser ride at Spoke and Vine and it was one of the busier nights, and the rumor mill, it gets…

JS: It was the first week of May.

JC: First week of May, yeah. So, the rumor mill came around and we heard that John Sabal was looking to sell the Palisade Cafe, and if he didn’t sell the Palisade Cafe by the end of the month, he was going to close.

JS: New lease starting June 1.

JC: We had literally just opened up the bar. So we had grand plans – we’re going to open up the bar and whatnot. The paint is barely dry at this point on this venture that is the investment in the bar. And we look at each other and we’re like, oh no. Palisade…and I wonder who would buy it, and in a month?

JS: Less than a month!

JC: We’re going into tourist season, and it’s sometimes a struggle to find, you know, food on the busier weekends in Palisade. So we were just worried about our guests. And selfishly worried about us, that we were going to lose another food option. Jeff and I typically like to eat out. And so we were very worried and reached out to John to ask if it’s true. Often when we hear rumors, Jeff and I are the people that, we just go right to the source. So, anybody listening, you know if you’ve ever received a phone call from us asking.

JS: Yeah, this is what we heard.

JC: Right, this is what we heard.

JS: Let’s just kibosh it now.

JC: So I called John and he said yep, yep, it’s for sale. So I’m like, OK, well, just kind of kicking around the idea, just so we know…

JS: Let’s meet.

JC: Let’s meet. I’ll have my list of questions, you bring whatever you have to show me… I think it was like, the next Monday…

JS: It was two days. It was the next Monday night, I think, because I was working the bar and you guys met in room ten. Yeah, I remember that part now. But you guys met, and then came out, and he was like oh, someone else is buying it.

JC: Yeah, so he shows up for his meeting and someone else is buying it.

JS: All right!

JC: We’re like, OK, great. And then we started thinking, we started thinking, and then we heard, maybe the other deal, not sure if that’s going to go through and then, ah, so a few weeks later, or a week later, I go to Jeff and I’m like, what do you think? Should we, should we do it? Should we try? Don’t know? So we kicked it around for a little bit, and then, and then two weeks, halfway through May, we’re like, let’s do this. We got a lawyer involved, look over the contracts, and here we are, buying a restaurant, two weeks notice, we’re closing on June 1.

JS: So we had to work with John, not only for the restaurant, but the landlord. So it was a really quick transition.

JC: And a little complicated!

JS: And a little complicated. Because the landlord was like, well, hold on, maybe I don’t want you in there. Maybe I want to find someone else, because now the lease is up, it’s like, fair game. So we’re like, oh crap. One more hiccup. Because we had already worked it out with John, the restaurant owner, we’re going through the process. Then we’re like, oh wait, right. He might not. So he interviewed like three people, we told him what our vision potentially was, and he actually chose us. And he – the landlord lives in Palisade, he knows us, he knows what we did with the motel. So, he, it was kind of a no-brainer for him, because he knows who we are. But he still had to go through the due diligence for him. It was, yeah, so here we go…

JC: So here we are…

JS: We closed on the Palisade Cafe on June 1st, which was my birthday. It was a great birthday present! Best birthday present ever.

JC: Here we go, we bought you another job! So we got…

JS: Bought you another job…

JC: So Jeff, we close…

JS: We come in, we do inventory…

JC: And we were just, again, it’s the same thing…

JS: Interviewed the staff…

JC: It was like, what are we doing here right now?

JS: We didn’t want it to close.

JC: So, we closed, we had no runway if you will. To really know the operation, see what was going on, and both of us had pretty extensive restaurant backgrounds. So it wasn’t that hard, as far as the operating, but we inherited their whole staff, and you know, they were great. And we just thought, let’s keep it open for the summer, let’s see what we see, see what the staff is telling us, see what our guests are telling us…

JS: We’re not going to change the menu on the staff that’s been doing it for so many years.

JC: We didn’t have a vision, we didn’t have a concept. So we’re like, let’s just, let’s just keep running.

JS: They were nervous, they didn’t know what was going to go on. So they were very questioning to us, like who are you, what are you doing here? So of course we paused and thought about our answer. And then we got to it pretty quick. We knew what was great about the cafe – we also knew what wasn’t great about the cafe. So we focused on what we thought wasn’t great to kind of build it up for the summer. And I think we did. We had a great team, who, you know, you’re always going to lose some people, you’re always going to gain some people. We ultimately had a great team that got us through that season and then we decided to close. We finally talked about what our vision was going to be for what is now Fidel’s. Didn’t have the name at the time. And then closed and then we just started ripping the place apart. And that was a little nerve-wracking, because we didn’t own the building. So now we’re putting all this money, we’re investing all this time and money, into a building that we didn’t own.

JC: When Jeff and I discussed the concept of what we wanted to see, for us, when we would go out in Steamboat, we actually went to Salt and Lime, the place that Jeff ultimately came to be the GM. But when we travel, we seek out tacos and tequila and mezcal. And that’s always been our thing for the last seven-ish years. So, we thought, OK, what could Palisade use? And for us…

JS: In our opinion.

JC: In our opinion, we wanted to create a restaurant that was mid-range but had table service. And had a really nice bar where you could just come in and grab a drink. So we designed the menu so that it can appeal to locals and tourists alike. For us, consistency is probably the most important thing if you’re going to attract locals. We want to make sure the drinks are always made the same, the food is always the same.

JS: The service is always the same. Consistency with the product and the service. The personality. And that’s very much what it is, which is very much what Spoke and Vine was about when opened that. That’s what we’re about.

JC: Yeah. We don’t feel that there is many options for a Mom and Pop restaurant that is kind of middle of the road that has table service. So that was what we were hoping would set us apart.

JS: And again, since covid, a lot of restaurants had to shift. And this is absolutely not a dig on anybody for doing what they do, but we want table service when we go out. I mean, we go to places that has counter service and we enjoy it, it is what it is and we know what we’re getting into. But when we go out to eat, we want to have a server, we want to have a conversation with that person, we want to hear the story of the restaurant or the story of, or whatever their story was, and so it was important to us to get that back. Especially in Palisade, like, not that nobody else is doing that, but that’s what we wanted for Palisade. We were a little nervous, opening tacos, tequila, and mezcal! It’s different. It’s just different.

JC: It’s different. And then, the Palisade Cafe, we were the twelfth owners of the…

JS: Thirteenth owner! Palisade Cafe 12.0 was John, then he changed it to the Cafe Wine Bar. We were the 13.0.

JC: It was eleven, I thought.

JS: I don’t think so. Check the records!

JC: It was Palisade Cafe 11.0, we were the twelfth owners of the Palisade Cafe…

JS: No, no, I’m pretty sure it was thirteen, because I was like, we cannot be the thirteenth owner.

LM: Is this where they like, skip the thirteenth floor, so…

JC: Totally. It wasn’t the thirteenth. 11.0. So, anyway.

JS: OK.

JC: We were…

JS: Sure. I’m wrong.

JC: So, as the twelfth owners of the Palisade Cafe, I think every owner put their own little spin on the place. And after awhile, the menu was a little all over the place. As was the décor. And the worry was, through that first summer, people would come in and they’d say, are you going to put back that Ruben that the fourth owner had on the menu? And I’d look at them like, I don’t even know who that was! So, what we felt like was that we were always going to be compared to the eleven previous owners, for better or for worse. And for us, we thought, let’s just scratch that plan entirely and build something, again, unique, fresh, that, that embodies our personality and our taste. The worry always is, are our tastes in line with what can keep the doors open? You know, restaurants are…

JS: Pay the bills, keep people employed… all that.

JC: Restaurants are fickle. You know, you might like it, but are you going to go? For us, in a tourism economy, Palisade is busy-ish from the middle of April until the middle of October. So you make money and you have to squirrel it away and hope that though the winter, you know, you lose less. And we really rely on the locals to keep us afloat year-round. When we decided on a concept, we kept asking ourselves, would they want to come here in January? Are the locals excited enough to come in February?

JS: And they were!

JC: We’ve had a lot of locals, a lot of the same faces showing up.

JS: From De Beque, Palisade, all the way out to Mack.

JC: Glade Park!

JS: Like what, oh my God, thank you! Like, I want to hug these people that are driving all the way in here for this restaurant. Like, that’s amazing. And again, Jody said it earlier, but we built Spoke and Vine the way we like to travel. We built Fidel’s the way we like to eat. We worked with a consultant on our menu. We worked on the cocktails. But it was ultimately how we enjoy our lives. It goes back to, welcome to our family. This is who Jody and Jeff are.

LM: Right, and you’re spending a lot of time there, so you’d better like the food and you’d better like the drinks!

JS: A lot! Right!

JC: Right! Absolutely!

JS: Yeah, if I’m not gonna eat it, why would I ask anybody else to eat it or drink it? I eat a taco pretty much every day! Luckily this is a podcast and not a video.

LM: There’s no taco belly! What’s your favorite taco?

JS: The bomb-ass fish, man! It’s, I love battered fish. I mean, I like fish. And then, carne asada, oh, it’s all good.

JC: I think the cauliflower taco.

JS: The cauliflower’s good.

JC: It’s different, it’s fresh. I feel like I’m eating veggies without having to eat a salad.

JS: You can still call it a taco! It’s in a tortilla.

JC: Totally.

LM: And you have an extensive tequila and mezcal selection, and it seems like you are so into researching everything there is to know about mezcal and tequila, and actually going to Oaxaca and places like that and touring and tasting and bringing things home. You can really see the passion for that in what you guys have.

JC: Absolutely. We really love any agave spirits, and Jeff is the tequila expert in-house and I am the mezcal expert and we love sharing our knowledge and talking to other people who are into it. We knew we were going to have an extensive list of mezcal and tequila, and then we came up with the idea – again, we’re in Palisade and people are used to tasting wine, you know. The brewery scene is big obviously, where you can have flights. So we were like, how does this, people who come here are generally interested in comparing. Being into the food and liquor scene. So that’s where we came up with the idea of doing the flights. We see many tables just getting a full flight or a half flight even, and just having that conversational piece to compare them side by side. And there’s so much to know about the spirits and we’re constantly educating ourselves and having cool conversations with our guests as well.

JS: And you know, it is hard. It’s really hard to go to Oaxaca once a year. It’s, it’s a tough life, you know. We’ve been there twice now, and we’re already planning next winter to go down with a couple of our employees who want to go and learn. I mean, I would never have gone away with my boss, like, what?! Are you crazy? These people want to go away with the owners of the restaurant who they work side by side with, like we don’t spend enough time together? Let’s go! That’s awesome.

LM: I mean, it sounds good. I’ll go!

JS: Let’s go! We should do a Oaxaca Palisade trip!

JC: I keep thinking about that.

JS: We’ll do the itinerary, you guys get your lodging…

JC: We know hospitality, we can put together a tour.

JS: Yeah, I don’t know if I want to do that full-time, though.

JC: Not full time! January!

JS: I mean, full-time for the two weeks while we’re there.

JC: We do really want Fidel’s to be a local spot. So there are a few things that we’ve done to help foster that relationship and show that we’re here for you, because you’ve been here for us. We only take reservations for the tables inside, but the bar we don’t take reservations for, and then we don’t take reservations for the patio, because we want people to be able to walk in and those sections can turn over a little quicker. We might not have that table right that second or a bar seat right that second, but that’s our hope, is to keep the locals counting on us – that they can get in the car, jump on a bike, walk on down and odds are we can get them in. We also do that…

JS: The rewards program.

JC: So we do a rewards program…

JS: I don’t know much about it anymore. I’m not the front of the house. I am solely in the back of the house at this point.

JC: So we have a rewards program at Fidel’s, where, if you leave your phone number and you pay with a credit card, it will remember your credit card, and basically – or if you pay cash, we can do the phone number – but what it is, if you spend $100, you get $10 off your next time in. So it’s basically 10% off. And that really is that thank you to the locals for helping us, sustain us through the winter. We know we’re going to be a seasonal business, but we really would love to be able to keep our staff employed through the winter. This winter we were nervous we were going to lose a lot of great people, but we limped along good enough and we were able to keep our stars from the season. That just propels us into a much better and smoother tourist season when it does happen. They’re trained and ready.

JS: We do Sparkle Donkey shots for people on their birthday. If no one knows what Sparkle Donkey is – it’s a really tasty vanilla reposado tequila. It’s really good. It’s fun to drink. It’s fun to say.

LM: Oo! I’ll be there on my birthday in September!

JC: Yeah! Please do!

LM: So the only negative feedback that I ever see about Fidel’s is, occasionally, people are like, oh, it’s so expensive. But I think I know a lot of the reasons for that, but how do you respond to those people?

JS: Um, there’s Jody’s response and then there’s Jeff’s response. You know, I get it. When we built the menu, we priced the food out and we literally said to ourselves, are we really going to have an $8 taco? Yes, we are. We’re going to have an $8 taco. We’re going to have more than one. Because of the type of food that we’re doing – scratch kitchen, everything’s prepped. Daily. Every other day. The type of fish that we’re using – wahoo, flown in, fresh. And the amount that it takes to actually run a restaurant. The invoices that we get, from our purveyors? They have surcharges. They have gas surcharges, regular gas surcharges, delivery fees. So, once our menu is set, we’re pretty much set, but everybody else gets to adjust their prices. So we have to balance that act out throughout the year, because we’re not going to make the same amount of money that we’re going to make in July as we are in December. So it has to balance out. And if it’s, if people don’t understand that, if they’ve never done that or realize that, then of course they’re going to ask, why’s it so expensive?

JC: There are so many extras that go into a brick and mortar operation. The fact that we’re a Mom and Pop restaurant – we don’t have the economies of scale that an Outback can have, or a chain restaurant can have.

JS: The buying power.

JC: The buying power, the advertising power, our software – our reservation software, the fact that you can make a reservation, actually does in fact cost us money for those conveniences. It does add up. Our bookkeeping, everything. It’s important that everyone knows that all of our pricing is based on the cost of running a business. And unfortunately, if we drop our prices, we’re not going to have the margins to sustain a business or have Jeff and Jody literally under the roof, making sure everything is right. That’s where that extra money does go somewhere. It sustains the heartbeat, it sustains the level of service. We have a host or a hostess. We have an expo, we have extra bartenders, all of these things. You know, pouring craft cocktails where literally, we pay, our day bartender is squeezing juice all morning.

JS: The hand-squeezer press!

JC: That, you know, it costs money. The cost of limes, the cost of avocados. It’s not taken lightly. We know, if we dropped our prices, we could be busier, but we might not be able to keep the doors open. So it’s very important, and I totally get that, to some people it is expensive because, you know, it is. And going out to eat is considered a luxury.

JS: But that’s also why it’s so important to us to have the service. Because that costs money too. We pay our people well. They’re taken care of. There’s a lot of hidden fees that people don’t know about. And while everybody else can adjust their fees, we can’t bounce that menu back and forth. I mean, that’s just not how it goes. It’s just not. And we have to swallow that very large pill sometimes to say, this isn’t the month for us, because we got all these extra charges. And you know, that’s just what it is.

JC: You know, we’re just one lowly little restaurant. We can’t strong arm our vendors. And that’s not who we are.

JS: Yeah, we want to work together with everybody, not against them. I’m not asking anybody to cut their price. I get it. I’m a business owner, I know what it takes, your price is your price. I’ll shop it, but your price is your price. I respect that. Much like our price is our price.

LM: I think it’s interesting too, because at the same time, people often compliment the service, and the food, and it’s like – these things go together. You’re keeping these staff because you’re paying them a living wage. And you’re keeping the restaurant open through the winter for the locals – and I appreciate that – and those things cost money. So yeah, I was just curious about that, because again, it’s an easy thing just to throw off as a complaint without understanding what goes into it.

JS: And I have to say, thank you for asking that question. We’ve done a few of these – the podcasts, and interviews – and I don’t know if anybody’s really ever – we’ve talked about money and vendors and all that, but nobody’s ever really directed the question towards why. So it’s a good opportunity for us – and it’s not a defense – we’re explaining it. There’s a lot more going on. So thank you for asking the question.

LM: You’re welcome. That’s me, I always want to know why. That’s why I wanted to do this.

JS: And we’ll talk to people left and right. If they ask the questions, we’ll give them the answers. We have nothing to hide from people!

LM: I’m taking up a ton of your time, but I just have a couple more questions. I think we’ve touched on this already, but what do you like most and least about running your own businesses?

JC: I…

JS: I’m gonna see how this goes. How different or alike our answers are.

JC: I always thought I would own my own business. As a kid, I was the one that was always rallying my friends to sell something, do something, invent something. I think it suits me, personally. Somebody said this and it’s always resonated: I work 80 hours a week so I don’t have to work 40. And I love the flexibility around that. I think of myself as an adult that knows how to manage my to-do list, so when my work is done, then I get to play. And if something needs to get done, well then, play needs to hang tight a little bit. And I really love employing people. I love having teammates, I love having people in it alongside of me, pushing me to create something and be better. I think that that’s important. And owning your own business, you have the opportunity that, if you work hard, you can get rewarded for it.

I think the worst part about owning your own business is, you can’t press pause on it. It’s very difficult to take a day off. It’s very difficult to relax your mind and switch off and think about other things. Jeff and I, and luckily, I’ve always liked my jobs and I’ve always liked the work I do, so we talk about work a lot. But, it’s a very difficult thing to press pause on.

JS: Yeah. I think the worst part for me is – and, it’s not even the worst, I guess. It’s just the time commitment. It’s 100% of your life. That’s what it is and we signed up for it. I accept it. But sometimes, you know, you’re just tired. You’re just tired, and you need a break.

LM: You can’t call in sick.

JS: Yeah, and you don’t get to call in sick. Unless you have covid. So, some days you pray you have covid. I’m kidding. Knock on wood. But, you know, it’s just the level of involvement, especially when you say, owning your own business. Hospitality business is different. A restaurant, a motel, because you have your employees, you have your guests, and if you don’t, if you’re not on with one, then you’re probably on with the other, vice versa.

So the best part is also that. I’m on with my guests, I’m on with my employees. Like, we have a really cool group of people that work here, as well as at the motel. And we hang out with all of them. And really, the ultimate best part of having our own business, especially hospitality, is the amount of time I get to spend with people. I like people, I really do. I get burnt out, of course, but I can recharge. But I get energy from talking to people and selling what we do and people asking about us and wanting to hear about us. That’s energy. That’s a positive thing, that people want to know about me. Like, what? Like, I grew up in Delaware! It’s kinda cool. Lot of cool stuff. And it’s hard to look at up close, and get out of your own way when you’re running your own business and just in the mix constantly.

JC: I was gonna say for you, that, I was gonna say for you, that the worst part is, Jeff wakes up every day, trying to figure out how the world is going to screw him.

JS: I’m not…!

JC: So everyday he wakes up and he knows something is going to break, someone’s going to call in sick, some delivery isn’t going to be made, and guess who’s going to pick up the slack? Jeff. So, Jeff lives in constant angst that something is going mess up his day.

JS: That’s not just this! That’s the way I grew up…

JC: And when you own your own business, the buck stops there. Like, you have to fix the problem. It’s only on you. You’re not calling in a lifeline. At the end of the day, you have to take care of it. And that is also the greatest thing. Because you are the problem solver. And that’s cool. People do look at you to fix it.

JS: Yeah, there’s just not enough time, really, for what we do in the day. Honestly. I wish I had more time, and more energy to do all the things. But yeah, I’m a glass is half-empty guy. Like, what’s going to happen today that I have to fix? That’s where I live. It always has been, and, you know, that’s just what it is. Thanks Jody. Like, my phone’s been ringing off the hook, so I can just imagine what I’m going to walk into when I go down…

LM: Well, I’ll just ask you one more question. What’s your favorite part about the Palisade community, or what’s your favorite … or wait, well, I want to ask you two more. What’s your favorite part about the Palisade community?

JS: My favorite part about the Palisade community? Um, I think, probably the chillness of it. Palisade’s – not that Steamboat wasn’t, but Palisade’s different because it’s small. We have 1,500 [LM note: 2,500+ actually] people that live in this town and it’s pretty chill, for the most part, it’s pretty chill. You have golf carts riding down the road for Pete’s sake. You can ride your bike without getting yelled at. The people that you do interact with that are out on the streets – they’re cool. They’re nice people. And I think that’s what I like the most about it. I walk into the grocery store – granted, I go into the grocery store about five times a day! But they know me. They’re like, oh, it’s the guy from Fidel’s! There he is again!

JC: There he is again, picking up salt.

JS: So, you know, I think that’s my….

JC: What was that question?

LM: What’s your favorite thing about the Palisade community?

JC: I think my favorite thing about the Palisade community is how supported we feel. At first, like I said, we didn’t know many people for quite sometime, but after we started getting out and about, there are other business owners in particular – Gary and Linda up at Restoration, Matt and Ashley over at Peche

JS: Mary at Slice O’Life, Rondo at the bike shop, Mark with Pedicab

JC: Edwin and Shari at TWP, like so many people, like we’re totally going to forget…

JS: Mora and Bran, formerly known as Mesa Park. Like, really cool people!

JC: Really cool people, and…

JS: You!

LM: Aww, what?

JS: You guys come in, you’re doing this! This is supporting us. That, that’s…

LM: This is the community that I want to live in, right? I want to build the community that I want to live in, too.

JC: And I think, more people have helped build us up when we’re low than have put us down. And have reassured us to follow our instincts, keep moving forward, and I hope that we do that for them, and that’s the type of people that we want to associate and also that we want to be.

JS: Yeah. We want to support people as best we can.

LM: So when you do get that rare day off, what do you do?

JC: I would say, when we have a day off, we often…

JS: Wake up, drink coffee on our deck, talk about work…

JC: Talk about work! Then we’ll walk our dogs, we’ll take Fidel for a walk.

JS: Yes, Fidel! Fidel’s still alive, that’s not a tribute restaurant. He’s still very much alive.

LM: What does he think about having a restaurant named for him?

JS: It’s nerve-wracking. He lives much like Jeff, in constant angst. Like, he’s not sure what kinda pressure’s on him.

JC: So, we’ll take him for a walk down at Riverbend. I have a horse in Fruita. I will often go out and ride my horse out in Fruita, maybe go trail riding.

JS: I have a dual sport motorcycle I like to ride. Cruise around. Go for a bike ride. Play pickleball – we love to play pickleball.

JC: Oh, our courts here in Palisade are amazing! And then grab a cocktail and some dinner. Just out in Palisade. Cruise around and, our best day is when we don’t have to leave Palisade.

JS: Yeah. Yeah. Unless we’re going to Mexico.

JC: You’re smiling as you think about both things.

LM: It sounds like a nice day!

JC: That would be lovely!

JS: I’m looking forward to that day off in January, next year! It’s going to be a good day. I’m drinking a lot of coffee that day.

LM: Thank you both so much for your time, for sharing your stories. It was really cool.

JS: Yeah of course, it’s fun. We appreciate it.

If you listened to the last three episodes, you may have noticed a common theme. Nelly, Cody and Mike, Jeff and Jody – they all saw something that wasn’t working as well as it should be or that was in need of repair and they said to themselves – you know what, I think I can fix this. I can make this place beautiful. They all saw their vision through ups and downs until they achieved their goals. Because if not them, then who?

If you’re enjoying this podcast, let me know by leaving a rating or review on Apple Podcasts or a follow or rating on Spotify.

If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com.

The Postcards from Palisade podcast is available on all major podcast distribution platforms. Find us and subscribe now so you never miss an episode. Latest episodes and links to more information are also posted on the website postcardsfrompalisade.com.

Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.

E5: The Homestead – Cody Butters Lewis

Cody Butters Lewis and her husband Mike own and operate The Homestead, the newest lodging establishment in Palisade. Cody and Mike bought the property in 2021 and spent the next 14 months renovating it. Cody and I talked about all the ups and downs of that process, what has changed in Palisade since she grew up here, what she values most about the Palisade area, and more.

For more info about The Homestead, check out their website: thehomesteadpalisade.com.

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that’s all about the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Today I’m talking with Cody Butters Lewis. Cody and her husband Mike own and operate The Homestead, the newest lodging establishment in Palisade.

Cody and Mike bought The Homestead in 2021 and spent the next 14 months renovating it. We talked about all the ups and downs of that process: “The nights were hard, when we were looking at the bills and how we were going to do it. And honestly, I have no idea how we did it. It was the hardest year of my life.”

And about what has changed about Palisade since Cody grew up here: “We were a more well-kept secret. We’re not so well-kept anymore. But that’s OK, because if you don’t grow, you’re stagnant.”

And what Cody values most about the Palisade area: “Our agricultural heritage is the most important thing to Palisade and we wouldn’t have what we have without the Colorado River. I’m so proud that I went to school with people that are now farmers. We all benefit from them keeping it so beautiful here and having this agricultural piece in Palisade is special.”

Keep listening to hear all that and more.

Thanks so much for spending some time with us today.

Cody Butters Lewis (CBL): I’m Cody Butters Lewis, and I’m a Palisade native, but just moved back about 14 months ago. My husband and I and our two kids bought the old Palisade Lodge, it’s now The Homestead, a little boutique inn/motel. I also have another job that helps pay the bills, but we won’t talk about that right now, we’ll just talk about this!

Lisa McNamara (LM): Sounds good! So what made you decide to open a lodge and buy this property?

CBL: Oh, so many things. Love the hospitality industry, love people. Some might say it’s just kind of a built-in, natural instinct for me, right, to just take care of people. Love that. But I’m also kind part of the post-COVID re-centering of your soul and life, and we were living in Texas and we had had our second child, and was just feeling the need to get back to Colorado, get closer to family, but also trying to figure out how to make a living here.

And I had actually been looking at this property for probably close to a decade, and was kind of waiting to see if it would ever go on sale. It never did. Actually, I just came and knocked on the door of the owners, and asked if they would ever be willing to sell, I was alive and willing to buy! But was very respectful in doing so, I wasn’t trying to make them feel like I was being pushy in any way. But that’s kind of the beginning part of the story!

LM: And so, when you knocked on the door, what did they say?

CBL: Sooooo…

LM: Eventually, obviously, they said OK!

CBL: Eventually would be the key word! We, well she, the owner, she was a little bit taken aback, but she said they were interested in selling. Her and her husband had gotten ill and just were having a hard time keeping up with the place. It also hadn’t been operating as a lodge since probably 2007, is what I can kind of deduce from their paperwork. And so, she said she was interested and she said she was talking to another private buyer and again, ever so delicately, I said, well, can you give me a range? What you’re looking for? And you know, I had no idea whether we could do it or not. It just kind of, the conversation just evolved as we were standing on the front porch. And so she gave me a range and I went right to the – I left here and gave her my card and I called the local real estate folks over at Craig Realty – Fruit & Wine, excuse me! And I was like, what is going on? What is this, is this, is that, who’s trying to buy this place?!? And trying to figure everything out. And without getting into the, like, all the crazy details, we ended up getting under contract I think three months later, without ever stepping foot inside the property! I’d only really been on the front porch.

LM: Wow! So what was it about this specific place?

CBL: I mean, truth be told, watching what Jeff and Jody did with the Spoke and Vine was incredibly inspirational. I mean, I had been going by that motel my whole life and kind of just stopped paying attention to it, just because it was there. And to see them come in with a vision and take, you know, a pretty key part of Palisade and make it beautiful and fun and relevant was completely just – I was like, why didn’t I think of that?! But I couldn’t take on a project of that size. This felt like something that maybe we could do. Again, had no idea if we could do it or not as we were moving through the process. So that was a big thing.

And then again, paying attention to hospitality and that being something that is important to me and my husband. This felt like something that would be a good opportunity for us.

LM: And how many rooms is it?

CBL: So, we technically have six bedrooms but it’s five units. We have four rooms with two queen beds and then two rooms with a king bed, and then five and six are joined by a door so it’s technically a two-bedroom suite.

LM: That’s a nice size. It seems really manageable in terms of the number of people you’d have here on a regular basis.

CBL: Yeah, Spoke and Vine I think has 18 rooms. So six rooms, and a house. We do have the house, too. Oh and that was the other part, right? Like, this is a cool situation where it’s our business and our home, so, I don’t know very many places that operate like this, so uniquely. We can do it because we live here as well as have the Homestead as our business.

LM: When did you close on the property?

CBL: Let’s see, it was December 17th, 2021, and we started construction December 19th, 2021!

LM: So you closed, you got over here, you saw it for the first time, and two days later you started demoing?

CBL: Well, our first walk-through was actually, so we got it under contract in August of 2021 and we came over, we flew up from Texas and did an inspection and a walk-through. So that was the first time that we actually got to get inside the building. We didn’t know that the house was a duplex, so two kitchens, two living rooms, it was split in half, two different entries. Very, you know, unique layout. The rooms, you know, they had a lot of stuff in there and things weren’t working properly. There were things leaking – the toilet and the sink and we kind of had to think the worst as far as septic system and what we would have to do there.

We did do a commercial inspection at the same time, so we had all kinds of engineers out here, checking things out for us to let us know if, you know, the bones were good. Was the plumbing OK, like how much would we really have to get into this. And actually, the bones were good! So the bones were good, but we did end up having to replace damn near everything!

LM: Right, because you’re not on the city sewer. Are you on city water?

CBL: We’re on Palisade water, thank goodness. Best water on the planet!

LM: So the sewer was the only thing you had to handle yourself…

CBL: Yeah, our septic system, so we have a septic on the house and then a septic on the back six, is what we call it. And we had to redo the septic for the lodge but not for the house. So this was in working order, but we had to replace all of the plumbing, all of the electrical, water heaters, all the things. I didn’t buy one toilet, I bought nine toilets!

LM: Excuse me sir, I need to buy these toilets in bulk!

CBL: I know, I was like, sweating in Home Depot, can I have nine of these? It’s just a weird experience, you know. And again, we were – the nights were hard, when we were looking at the bills and how we were going to do it. And honestly, I have no idea how we did it. We financially really stretched ourselves out, but with projections it will recover. And we will, we’re going to do just fine, and the support of the community has been amazing. From our neighbors – you know, coming into a place that hadn’t been running as a business for quite some time, I didn’t know if that was going to be well-received, and it was. Everybody’s been so great, and so we’re really, really fortunate in that aspect. And then, all the local business owners, everybody that’s been willing to – whether it’s been giving us advice, or helping us get our name out there. It’s been fantastic. So I’m not worried – we’re, we’re going to be OK.

LM: Yeah, but it’s scary at the start. And overwhelming in the middle of a renovation project, especially this big.

CBL: Incredibly.

LM: You said there’s a good story about the renovation, or probably good stories. How long did it take?

CBL: It was about 14 months, I think, when we first started working with our general contractor. And my husband was here – and when I say our general contractor, it was him and his father out here every day, working themselves, which I just thought was so cool. And it was my husband and his brother out here working, and then it was the septic guy and his dad were working, and I got some fun pictures, and I was like, yeah, it’s a full family affair out here! It was very – I don’t know if intimate’s the word – but it just, you know, felt right. Like, it was really cool. It was a family affair.

So yeah, our first plan was, I think we were told about five months of renovation. And then I’m not sure if you know this, but 2022 was a rough year when it comes to construction costs! Everything was crazy. It took longer because we waited at certain stages for prices to come down or things to shift a little bit. We were fortunate to have people on our side there too, to have the wherewithal to help us save a little bit of money and try get it done within budget. Which, we were definitely not within budget, but, that’s mostly my fault. It’s mostly my fault.

LM: It’s really hard!

CBL: It’s so hard! I don’t even know why we have a budget at this point. So. But it’s done! So there you have it!

LM: Yes, you’re on the other side of it now. What was the weirdest thing that you found through the process?

CBL: Oh my gosh, that’s a tall question. I uh, well, we had a wasp problem that was attacking everybody that was working on the property. And then, I told you about the carpenter ants. Not on here! So we had our hot tub – our hot tub? We had a hot tub in the gazebo, and it was full of carpenter ants, which, by the way, is not fun to like, get in there and try to remediate. So that was dangerous, and yet handled.

One of my favorite stories was, so when we closed on the property and I hired the general contractor two days later, the next day – oh no, I think it was a few days later, because we had to clear out the garage, it was full of stuff. But we needed to unload our two U-Hauls from Texas. So they were sitting out in front of my dad’s house on G Road. We had to get all the stuff out of the garage so we could unload our things.

So we had all of our friends come over one afternoon and they unloaded those U-Hauls in an hour and a half. It was amazing, it was like a well-oiled machine. And I had already had a big dumpster dropped off and because we got done so quickly, my girlfriends just looked around, and just started picking up stuff and throwing it in the dumpster. I think it was almost like a therapy session! But there was, you know, a lot of leftover items and trash and furniture and so many things. We filled that dumpster in like less than two hours and we were having a blast doing it. That was a good day, but it was like the beginning of a very long journey, but that was a good day.

LM: Was there ever a moment that you were just, like, I don’t want to do this.

CBL: Yes. Many moments, I will be honest about that. I mean, when I, ugh, I almost have to fight back tears sometimes! But it was the hardest year of my life. And hard on our marriage and again, without the support of my dad – we lived over at the house I grew up in my whole life, rent free, thank god. My kids stayed in my old bedroom together, but they were troopers. They were so happy and had a blast. They loved staying at grandpa’s farm. Because you worry about that, right? Are you messing up the kids, are they OK? They were fine, they had a great time.

But we, you know, again, never going through something like this, you never know what to expect. You can plan all day, but plans are made to be broken, in my opinion. And tough conversations, you know, trying to find the money when you really, really need it. It was incredibly stressful. Oh by the way, I had started a new job, and I was traveling a lot. But had to do it so we had some financial stability. But we got through it. But yeah, I would say October, November, I was really hurtin-scooter.

LM: That’s the thing that I really had to learn too is just like, things are going to go wrong. You will never have a perfect project, and no matter what you do, even if you think you have prepared, you’ve done everything right – something’s going to go wrong.

CBL: Amen, sister!

LM: There’s always something unexpected, and you just have to learn how to deal with that stuff and like, let go of the fact that, you’re thinking that it’s going to be perfect. Because it just isn’t! Something’s going to go wrong!

CBL: It isn’t. Something inevitably goes wrong – you’re so right. And looking back, all those hard conversations and sleepless nights and endless research and all these things…you know, there was never one time that I knew we wouldn’t do it. Did I want to walk away or take a reprieve – absolutely. But I knew we’d get it done. We had to! There was like, no other option. Like, we have to do this, we have to finish. And we’re fortunate enough that again, with support, with certain things falling into place for us, we were able to get it done. And we’re just – we’re happy! It’s turned out great, you know? It’s clean, it’s cute, and it’s cozy. It’s home.

LM: What’s your favorite part about running a lodge?

CBL: I like the people. It’s so fun. We’ve had people from Wisconsin, New Jersey, lots of – a few staycations, which by the way, thank you and a shout-out to all our friends and family that have come to just rent a room. In February I sent out, texted my girlfriends – same ones with the dumpster story – and I was like, hey guys, I need you to come break this sucker in! I need you come sleep in the beds and take a shower and use the towels. Mess with the heat, like make sure everything works. And did you sleep well, can you hear each other, what’s it like? And they did it and we had a great time. We had a really fun weekend, it was superbowl weekend so we kind of tied it all together. But they did, they came in, they rented the room, they got online, went through the whole process. So that was super fun.

But anyways, yeah, we’ve had a great time with the guests coming in. Orchard River View, right across the street, for weddings and special events has been real helpful for us. They’ve been great pushing people our way because we’re so close in proximity. You can walk there. I want to figure out maybe a little safer way to get there, a path, yeah something, I feel like we can do something, down the road. But yeah, it’s been great and we’re really looking forward to the summer. And I – I’m from Palisade, like I said. I love Palisade. I’m so proud of Palisade. So when we get our hands on our guests here, it’s really fun to toe the Palisade line, right? We have so much to offer, it’s a unique experience, it’s family-friendly, it’s affordable, it’s all the things that you need to have a good time and not stress about it stretching you out too thin or anything like that. I think it’s just the right place to visit, you know?

LM: The logo, your logo and then the room numbers on the door, they’re like a silhouette of…is it…a crow?

CBL: It’s a raven.

LM: A raven! Argh!

CBL: Yeah! Not a big difference between a raven and a crow, right?

LM: Yeah, my dad’s gonna be so – my dad’s gonna be so embarrassed when he hears this because he’s a huge birder. He’s going to be like, you didn’t know it was a raven?! Anyway.

CBL: Well it’s a little tough to tell because I think you tell the difference by their tail and the wing tips, which, the logo does not lean itself to super clear crow vs. raven. But we, so, working on the property, we were out here and every day, there were these ravens, just flying overhead, and you can hear them talking to each other. They fly like right in line with the Book Cliffs, to the east side of the property here. It’s just, I don’t know, it was a good omen for us.

And then, hanging out at my dad’s house – this is a side story – but hanging out at my dad’s house, where we were living last year, all these ravens were hanging out in the pecan trees, and I’ve never seen so many like, hanging out. And I was like man, I just feel like this is something, like it’s an omen, it’s a good sign, it’s something that means something to us.

And we were trying not to be another “Palisade” something. Palisade, you know what I mean? We were trying to find a name that would stand out a little bit but not be like, too off Palisade brand. And so Homestead it was, and the raven really just stuck with us. We were trying to not make it like too ominous-looking too, you know? But, ravens are good omens, and they were a very good personal omen for us.

LM: Well it’s like uplifting though, because it’s flying upward! It’s not some raven sitting there glaring at you.

CBL: Right? It’s not mawing down on some roadkill! No! That didn’t get voted in for the logo, I don’t know why! Just kidding. No, we like the raven, it’s cool.

LM: Are you ever thinking that you’re going to add on any kind of food service or anything like that in the future, or is that something where you don’t even want to go there?

CBL: I’m so glad my husband isn’t part of the podcast, because this would start a fight!

LM: Oh no!

CBL: I’m just kidding. But, kind of not! So, I think you and I share in these ideas of grandeur, right, and we want things to be what we want them to be. In my vision of the Homestead and what we were going to offer was breakfast and all the things. And we want to get there eventually. So, I think we’re going to start here in the summertime, once we get some more consistent bookings, is we want to do breakfast, brown bag breakfast, that’s what we’re going to call it. Brown bag breakfast. And we’ll shoot you a text – you know, do you want a burrito, a sandwich, or just a yogurt, something like that, and then throw in some local fruit, maybe a juice, and just leave it on the front step at like, eight o’clock or whatever.

You can opt out, you can opt in, but it’s not going to be like a, you know, do you want scrambled eggs? We’ll leave that to the experts at the B&Bs here in Palisade that do that really well. I think it’s important to have something like that. We’re just trying to manage the workload with the kids and me traveling and all that good stuff. So, that’s why it’s a differing opinion between Mike and myself – because he’ll be doing it! So, once we get him onboard! We’ll get there, we’ll get there. But I like it, brown bag breakfast. I think we’re going to start that sometime in May is what I’m hoping to do.

LM: Nice. And you have coffee in the rooms too, right?

CBL: Yes, and we do local coffee from Mountain Roasters in Grand Junction. They took over from the old Toucan, for those that will remember way back in the day. They just got new owners recently in the last couple months. But they’re wonderful, we love their coffee, it’s delicious. So we’re offering that in the rooms and then yeah, it’s really self-sustaining. Once you have your fun in Palisade, you come back with your goods, you don’t have to go anywhere if you don’t want to. You’ve got your wine opener, you’ve got your wine glasses, you’ve got your fridge, you got utensils, whatever you might need to just kind of kick back and relax and rejuvenate, so you can get after it again the next day, right?

LM: Yeah! And the back patio is so awesome with the view of the cliffs. I can see myself sitting out there with a glass of wine and just relaxing. I’m sure people will meet their neighbors. It’s a cool space.

CBL: Thank you so much. Yeah, that was the whole point with the backside – we have a really unique view of Buzzard’s Roost, is what that mountain is called back there. I did a little research and got some help from the Historical Society. John Buzzard I guess was his name, and he owned the land back there, so that’s why it’s called Buzzard’s Roost. It’s just cool, it’s a cool rock formation. And then yeah, we’re at the base of the Mesa, but it feels like the Book Cliffs. And Sauvage vineyard behind us, one of the few. It’s just, it’s just really pretty, and I think people enjoy hanging out back there.

LM: Are you planning any kind of public events this season?

CBL: So we want to do events. We have to get a conditional use permit from the county to be able to do so. I have a meeting next week! So we’re – we kind of have our list of things to do. It takes a decent amount of money. Gotta hire some traffic impact study stuff and engineers and some site plan things and some surveyors, and all the things.

LM: Wow…

CBL: So, so, I’ll get there. But, we can do private events, so I would just say, if you are interested in doing something here, just give us a call and we can talk through it and see what we can do for you. We’re incredibly accommodating and flexible because again, this is our home and our business and it’s at least worth a conversation.

LM: So having grown up here as a local Palisade…do we say Palisadian? Palisader?

CBL: You can! Palisadian…

LM: Palisade resident!

CBL: As a Palisade native – that’s what I like to say.

LM: Yeah, Palisade native. What’s your favorite part of the community and are there any stories or is there anything that a newer resident maybe wouldn’t know that you think is really special about the place?

CBL: Our agricultural heritage is the most important thing to Palisade, and we wouldn’t have what we have without the Colorado River. We wouldn’t have what we have without irrigation. You know, our peach orchards have been here for over a hundred and thirty years, I want to say. We’ve had people from all over the world come to work in this valley. And I do not know if this is still a true fact, but we used to be, and we still might be, the third largest producer of peaches in the country. And I just think that’s awesome. Again, we’re a little – we were a more well-kept secret. We’re not so well-kept anymore. But that’s OK, because if you don’t grow, you’re stagnant, right? But, I just think our agricultural heritage and our roots – pun intended – are so strong. And what we’ve done as farmers. I’m so proud that I went to school with people that are now farmers, you know? And they’re so smart, and I just love listening to what they’re doing and how they’re weathering these cold nights coming up, and how stressful it is, it just breaks my heart. But they’re on it, and they’re doing everything they can to save the fruit, and we all benefit from them keeping it so beautiful here. And having this agricultural piece here in Palisade is special. It’s special and it’s different from other parts of Colorado. Yes, we have mountains, but this is really the beating heart of Palisade, is our agricultural. That’s what I say. That’s what I would say.

LM: Absolutely. If and when, you get a day off, how do you enjoy it? That feels like an if!

CBL: Right? Are my kids with me or are they not with me? Just kidding. No, our kids really like to go hike the rim trail, actually, and our three year old actually does a pretty darn good job with minimal whining.

LM: That’s impressive, because it’s really steep!

CBL: I know, right? He does a pretty good job – we pick him up here and there but he does well. And Parker does a great job too. And so we like to hike, we like to bike, we go to Riverbend quite a bit. We love to ski in the wintertime and we actually got a few days in this year, which was really fun, at Powderhorn, and the snow was amazing, so that was awesome. I want to go to Glenwood here in like the next week or so, just do a little recharge trip. But I mean, honestly, we just enjoy being outside. We enjoy being outside here in Colorado, and that’s it. I mean, we’re pretty easy I guess, right? I mean, I’d love to go to St. John, but, that’s not in the cards right now. I mean, wouldn’t that be nice?

LM: That would be so nice, just sit on the beach…

CBL: Right? Wouldn’t that be so nice? I know, someday. Three to five years, we’ll get back at it.

LM: Yeah.

CBL: What do you like to do in your free time?

LM: Oh like the same! I love hiking, biking. You mentioned how nice it would be to have a path along here. Like, why is there not better bike infrastructure in Palisade? Just a sidewalk! Just something, because people, you don’t want to be walking on the shoulder of the road.

CBL: No!

LM: So anyway, I’m veering off into rant territory.

CBL: That’s OK, but also, like, we have a lot of work to do. We’re a work in progress as a community, as a town. We’re trying to figure this all out. Like the biking is kind of a newer-ish, right, in the last decade, pull for this area and we’ll get – we’ll figure it out. But the input is important, and letting our town folks know that we have these needs or thoughts, then we gotta work together to do it. But it can be done.

LM: Yeah, I’m hopeful it can be done and it’s just – you just need a slight improvement and it’ll be amazing. But yeah, I love biking around here, I like mountain biking – easy stuff.

CBL: So not the plunge?

LM: No! No, I’ve hiked the plunge and been like…how??

CBL: How?? I know!

LM: Seriously, like some parts are scary to walk down.

CBL: Me too, no, I know, and I’ve seen some people, like, carrying their bikes in certain spots and I’m like, how did you even get this far? Have you been carrying it the whole time? Or just this part?

LM: Oh yeah, I know, I’d be walking my bike the whole time. So, I like the easy stuff, over by Fruita, the fun flowy trails.

CBL: The lunch loops. Yeah, we like to mountain bike too, we haven’t gotten to go as much with the little ones. I guess there’s some really cool program someone was telling me about yesterday – Boneshakers, for kids, so they take them on the bike trails and teach them how to do it, so that would be cool.

LM: That’s awesome.

CBL: How cool would that be to learn that when you’re six or seven?

LM: One day when we were at 18 Road, there was a whole bus of very small children, and you know, their little bikes, and they were all kind of gathering to go down Kessel Run, and they were all gathering at the top, and my husband and I had just got out there and we were like, oh, we’d better hurry up and go before these kids go. And then we’re going down the trail and I’m like, that was so dumb, these kids are fearless, they’re so much better than me and they’re going to catch up to me!

CBL: They’re going to run you over!

LM: Yeah, they were so good.

CBL: That’s what I’m talking about, like, that’s so cool to have that opportunity, you know. I didn’t have that when I was a kid here, but I’m so glad that my kids will have the opportunity to do so. And they wouldn’t have had that if we had stayed in Texas. It’d just be different, a different lifestyle. Like, I do want to mention, like, because we really want to pull on the mountain biking community, because we are right here…

LM: Right here being?

CBL: Right next to the Palisade Plunge and the rim trail, and right at the beginning of the Riverfront Trail, but we have secure bike storage. We’re going to make it a little fancier, but right now it’s the garage, but it’s secure, so you’re welcome to it. And maybe there’s a shuttle service, something that we can partner with people on, or whatever, we want to figure that out. So as we evolve, I think the biking community will be a really good demographic for us.

LM: Definitely. If you’re biking over to the plunge trail, it’s not even – not even a half mile.

CBL: It’s just a quarter mile, it’s right there, you can see it.

LM: Right, come down off the plunge, roll right over here, go to the back patio…lie down!

CBL: Yeah, and just chill. Don’t forget to crack a cold one!

LM: Have a little panic attack!

CBL: I made it!

LM: That’s me, I shouldn’t talk for other people.

CBL: No, it’s terrifying. I mean, we started mountain biking in Utah, we lived in Park City, and it was so fun, we were having a blast, and then I got pregnant. Ah, the skiing this year. Do you ski?

LM: I do, but we didn’t get out there this year!

CBL: Oh bummer!

LM: I mean, there’s so much work on that house that it kind of – I mean it doesn’t even look like we made progress, but that was sort of like, what we worked on…

CBL: Totally understand. So like the first winter, we didn’t go, because we were so enthralled and swamped and poor! Like we can’t do anything.

LM: Oh yeah, that too!

CBL: Yeah, you’re like, phew. And so we were doing all that and then I bought passes for this last winter. I was like, we can go, we’re getting close to the end, and the kids hated it. Like, just laying there, like sliding down the hill!

LM: No way!

CBL: Me and Mike were losing our minds, like, come on! This is a family, like isn’t this fun?!? And they’re just like, I don’t want to, I’m so cold. So…you can’t give up! You just have to keep taking them. Hiking the stuff up the hill, dealing with the crying. I mean, even putting the ski boots on for the first couple times is a nightmare. But, the fourth and fifth time, ski boots go on…you know, put your foot in the ski boot monster! You sweat a little less carrying all the gear up the thing, because it’s not just their stuff it’s your stuff and everybody’s stuff – there’s so much stuff! And then Parker actually stayed up and then Cannon wanted to go do another run on the last day that we got to go. He was like, come on mom, let’s go do a run! And I was like, OK!! Yeah, so we’re getting there. So we’ll get there it’s a process. Everything’s a process.

LM: Anything else you wanted to add?

CBL: Um, we are running a promotion. We are running a promotion now through May 31st. We’re calling it Mother’s Day Sunshine and Wine. So come on down and – well, you don’t have to come here, you just book your room online, it’s up and running, I put it in there today – it’s 20% off your whole stay. But book and stay between now and May 31st. And we’re going to partner with Palisade Pedicab and do – I think they’re going to do 10% off for the wine tours. It’ll be a beautiful time of year, everything’s going to be blooming. It’s going to be pretty.

LM: It’s the best, too. Not too hot. Just perfect.

CBL: Perfect, yes, right?

LM: Well, thank you so much for your time.

CBL: Thank you.

LM: I really appreciate you reaching out. It was awesome to hear from you and I appreciate you making the time to talk.

CBL: Of course. Thank you for starting such a cool podcast for Palisade. I love it! I really appreciate it. I really do, I think this is going to be great. It’s fun to listen to, and informative, and helps us know what’s going on with all the local businesses and just people in general. It’s good. Thank you for doing what you do.

LM: Yeah, get to know your neighbors. So thank you! I appreciate that!

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If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com.

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Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.

E4: La Plaza (formerly known as Child & Migrant Services) – Nelly Garcia

Featuring Nelly Garcia, the Executive Director of La Plaza (formerly known as Child & Migrant Services or The Hospitality Center). Learn about the services La Plaza offers, the historic movement behind their current reorganization, and how you can get involved. Nelly shares her backstory that led to her being named the first Latina immigrant Executive Director for the organization. Nelly will leave you feeling inspired by her incredible passion for her work and for the community she helps support.

For more info about La Plaza, check out their website: laplazapalisade.org.

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that’s all about the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Today I’m talking with Nelly Garcia, the Executive Director of La Plaza (formerly known as Child & Migrant Services or The Hospitality Center). Keep listening to learn about the services La Plaza offers, the historic movement behind their current reorganization, and how you can get involved. Nelly shares her backstory (or, as she reminds me, pieces of her story!) that led to her being named the first Latina immigrant Executive Director for the organization. Nelly will leave you feeling inspired by her incredible passion for her work and for the community she helps support.

Thanks so much for spending some time with me today.

Nelly Garcia (NG): I’m Nelly Garcia. I am the new Director for Child & Migrant Services. We are changing our name – our new name is La Plaza. I started as a Director in August of 2021, so I’ve been here for about a year and a half, and it’s been a very nice experience to be a Latina immigrant Director. It’s the first time that I am a Director. I worked in the school district prior to this job.

Lisa McNamara (LM): The name change from Child & Migrant Services to La Plaza – can you talk a little bit about why that happened, or when that happened?

NG: Yeah! A year ago and a half when I joined, as I was sharing my personal story and where I come from and looking at the population that we serve – we serve about 100% migrant and immigrant Latinos. We noticed that our name – it was Child & Migrant Services. And as I was going out there, introducing myself, even though I’ve been here for a long time in the area, I’ve been working here for over ten years, I think, I’ve been in different positions, different organizations, so some of the community knows me from different organizations. But they were getting to know me as the Director of Child & Migrant Services. But as I was going out there and introducing myself, letting them know this was my new role, I started to realize that they knew us with different names.

There isn’t a really good translation for Child & Migrant Services. If you translate it, it sounds like Servicios Para Ninos y Sus Familias Migrantes, which is really not a great translation. It’s a long translation. It’s really kind of a definition instead of a literal translation. So they would call us El Centro. They would call us El Centro Migrante, they would call us El Centro de Immigracion, they would call us La Casita, they would call us La Mision, and then the names go on, and on, and on. So I shared that with the board and said, have you noticed that we don’t have a name that is THE NAME, in English and Spanish, that really represents what we do and then that our community recognizes as their own?

And then I started to get some other calls saying, I would like to donate to the children. And we would like to give this to the children. And yeah, we work with children – and their families. Previous in the history of Child & Migrant Services, I think late 70s or 80s, we used to have a childcare, but we no longer do that and we don’t do any direct service with childcare. But our name was still CHILD & Migrant Services.

So we realized the different understandings that our community had, as far as what we do, that were directly connected to our name. And we decided to say, let’s make the change. Let’s find a name that really represents what we want to do, our new vision and mission, and that our community is happy with.

So we started to think about the name that was well known, Centro. And there are so many Centros. There’s Centro de la Familia. There are so many community resource centers. And we didn’t want to be another Centro. We didn’t.

But then when we thought of the idea of Centro, and what the center of the city means, and when you think about where we come from – what is the center of our state or the center of our hometowns? You think of plazas. You think of the plaza that is next to the church that is next to the city council, city hall, and the center that really brings everything together. The resources, the food, the community, the culture, the language, the family, the reunion, the support. And we thought, well – why not La Plaza? It’s, again, a meaning of everybody coming together. A gathering place. Where people get or reach their needs. And we said, OK, let’s try it out!

We came up with the name and then asked our community, do you like this name? First, we did the kind of survey – how do you know us? What is our name, basically. And then we said – they gave us different names, and then we said, what do you think about this name?

And they liked it. They said, yes! And then, the question was, what do you think when you hear La Plaza? And everybody said, my hometown. It reminds me of home. It reminds me of where I come from. And this is really – Child & Migrant Services has been known for a home far away from home. And when they said it reminds me of home, that was exactly the meaning that we wanted to get to. A place where they gather and they feel like home. And that’s how we came up with La Plaza!

LM: That makes total sense!

NG: That’s a long story!

LM: No, but it makes complete sense, because it really is a center of so many communities in Central America. Like everything is built around, that’s the oldest part of the city, the place where all the festivals happen, everybody gathers, there’s food…

NG: Yeah and when you think of Palisade, even though we’re so far away, really, we, location-wise, we are the center of Palisade. And when we think about all the orchards going on around us, and all the people coming together here, we are the center. And there isn’t any other organization that does the work that we do or that is connected in the way that we are trying to connect with our community. So the meaning, it’s there. And we wanted to find, like, a perfect word. We didn’t want to have a long sentence that was again confusing and that they were not going to remember.

So we’re going to be re-branding, April 19th. We’re going to have an open house and we’re excited that we finally have a new name.

LM: Can you talk a little bit about the services that La Plaza provides?

NG: Our name comes from a new strategic plan and it comes from changing our mission and vision. We are here to serve, empower, and cultivate the well-being of migrant AND immigrant agricultural workers and their families in the Grand Valley.

Previously, some of our history has been supporting only migrant seasonal workers. Again, from the background that I come from, as an immigrant, and growing here in the valley, there isn’t any other organization that can support immigrants. As I came to this position, I realized we had a great opportunity. And we decided to go towards that opportunity. To expand our services to not only migrant seasonal but also the immigrant community that stays here.

We do have a lot of immigrant community that are seasonal agricultural workers that stay here year-round. But sometimes those are the people who are usually “hiding” from everything else. They are working and taking care of their families and that’s all. They’re not very involved with the community and those are the population that are not getting the resources they need. For many factors. We could go on and talk about why. But the fact is that they’re not getting the services. And that’s why we wanted to get this opportunity to serve them in a different way.

When you think about migration, you’re going to think of somebody coming to an area. Looking for work will be the first thing that they do. Then, engaging their families, their children to education. And then, what’s next, right? It’s going to take them about five years to settle in a place. To learn about the systems. And we were helping only the community that were here for five, six months out of the year, and going back. But what about those people that are needing a little bit more support to get settled, to feel part of the community. So now we’re opening up the services and how those services look like for everybody in the community that needs our support.

LM: I know a lot about – or, I don’t know a lot about, I shouldn’t say that! I know that some of the things you do are like, hot meals, support for translation services…it seems like there’s such a long list of things…

NG: It’s hard to not talk about the past, because of so many new things that we’re doing now, and the direction that we’re taking. We are changing from being a basic resource, community resource center, to a place where they find more than just the basics. Where they find empowerment. Where they learn how to feel part of the community. Where they learn how to become leaders. Where they learn how to use their voice to find representation.

In the past, we would only do hot meals. And connections to maybe healthcare. Finding them a way of getting them to a doctor. And we have a housing program for people coming seasonally that would get a house to live in during their time here. And then, clothing. We would get clothing donated from different resources – churches, or schools, or even individuals. We would pass that on. So those are – when you think of basics, that’s the basics. Your health, your housing, your food. We would get, have like a pantry that they would have access to.

So moving from that – what else the community needs. So one big piece is making sure they feel part of our community. So, community engagement – what does that look like in our community? Well, them coming and telling us, I need this. And this is different than what we offered, you know. Maybe in the way of education – I need to learn why my child is getting this information. Connecting the bridges of understanding of the systems. Obviously we know that the educational system is different from where they’re coming. How does that work here? Like, helping them understand that.

We want to move towards more empowerment. Teaching them skills. We want to do English classes. We want to implement other higher, adult education. There’s a program through the consulate, called Plazas. Yeah, plazas! And this gives them an opportunity to finish middle school, or finish high school in order to move towards a GED. We want to open it up to more education.

We are growing our connections with the community. We collaborate with the community food bank. We want to make sure that we have what they need, but they are connecting to the resources. So not only giving them a referral but making sure that the community resources are ready for them. Do they have Spanish speakers? And how do we support that, too? How do we support them to find what they need to serve the community that we are referring to them? So we are helping them figure out how that looks like.

We are keeping the hot meals. I think hot meals is a big part of social work. Because, again, we are working with people that come to housing and sometimes are isolated, they want to socialize with people. But we want to make sure that it’s in an interaction that is useful to them. So we’ll continue to do meal nights, but we’re turning them into resource nights. So we want to make sure that every time they come sit down and eat, they also have the opportunity to sit down and talk to a resource that’s out there in the community that they don’t know about. And that the resources are able to reach the community that they are targeting or wanting to get more resources to. So, it’s a two way road that we are trying to address, again, building the bridges.

We are actually trying this in a new, different way, which is a membership-style. When you think of a membership, you think of a Sam’s membership, right? You go pay a fee and then you get what you need. So it is very similar to this. And it comes from the idea of Cesar Chavez movement. Are you familiar with Cesar Chavez?

He was an individual who grew in California, and he was coming from a family of migrant agricultural workers, seasonal workers. And even though he was able to go towards education, achieve, I think he was able to graduate, and find a good job, he realized that agricultural workers, at that time, had a really hard time. So we’re talking about the times where they didn’t have breaks, they were living in a really tiny household with a family of five or six, they didn’t have safe working conditions, they didn’t have access to bathrooms. And he was the person who changed all of this. And he was able to do it by doing a movement of membership-style. He said, we’re going to create a union, and if you want to be part of the union, you’re going to have to pay a fee.

When you think of low income and you’re asking people to pay a fee, maybe you’re going to say, like, how could you?! How could you ask them for something like this?! But, basically what he was saying, he was saying, I’m going to give you a chance to be part of this movement. How do you feel when you buy something? And you know you’re paying for it and you work for it? It has much value to it. You really appreciate it, and you feel like you are part of it. So that’s what he was creating. He was creating a sense of belonging in his own organization. They were part of the movement because they funded the movement, and due to this movement they were able to have worker rights. And that’s the same idea that we want to try to get.

We are going to be asking for a donation. And it’s like $10 per member. But by saying you are a member, you have responsibilities and you have benefits. So everything, all our resources and services that we are going to be providing, it’s based on a membership. They’re going to come in, they’re going to register, we’re going to give them a card, and we’re going to call them members. Not clients. They’re not going to be clients anymore, they’re going to be members.

The main goal, again, is that one day, they’ll be our board of directors. That one day, they’ll be our voice as far as what are the resources that they need and what are the programs that they need. So we work towards an immigrant-led organization.

LM: You’re so inspirational, when you’re talking, I’m like, woohoo! No, but giving people ownership and giving them the ability to feel like they’re contributing, they’re not just taking services, they’re part of something. I can see how that’s huge. That’s wonderful.

NG: Yeah. It’s change. Sometimes change scares people. It’s going to be hard to explain, because when you think of something new, they’re going to be thinking of, how much do I have to give? Because I have given so much. When you think of their stories, when you think of everything they have to go through, they’ve already given too much. And we don’t want to say – we don’t want to ask for something that they can give. We want to ask for something that it’s going to really empower. It’s going to really show them that we care about them and that this organization wants to hear from them. We’re not only here to serve them, we’re here to hear them. To really understand where they’re coming from and supporting them.

Palisade is so far away from city. But we want to create those bridges, we want them to feel part of our community, not only people that come here for a couple of months, but people that really feel part of us, part of our decision making. How many decisions are taken without really considering their benefit, or not their benefit? And this is a time where we have to raise those voices. We need to hear those voices. And it’s going to be hard, and it’s going to be a process, but I think that we have a really set vision, and once we reach it, it’s going to feel good. Because there’s going to be a new organization, and it’s going to be new community, and you’re going to see the connections built.

LM: So you’re doing so much and you don’t have a huge staff, right?

NG: No! We are building our staff. We just hired a new Office Administrator. Coming up, we’re going to have our new Community Navigator. Our new staff, it’s very intentional. We are creating the positions in order to be able to implement the programs and services that we want to try this year. So the Community Navigator is really a case manager. We never had that before. It would only be somebody wearing different hats of outreach and somebody that was here taking care of the building. We realized that for us, to be able to support the community in the way we want to support them, we had to spend on staff and open and grow it.

So it was a change for us to say, OK, now we’re going to have full-time people? Yes, we are going to have full-time people! Because we really need it. One or two people cannot make everything that we want to do. It won’t be possible. We’ve been struggling so far, already. Because we have workers already coming and we’re barely getting the membership model started, and we’re not there yet, and they’re already here. So we have to hurry. We have to make sure we have the staff needed.

So we’ll have our new Navigator starting April 10th. And then our next hire will be a Community Outreach person. Which is going to be somebody going out in the community to reach out to them, tell them about our changes, tell them about the services that we are going to be having – so just letting them know everything that is going on and giving them an opportunity to register and sign up for our services out there. So that’s going to be a part time position for this season.

LM: I was going to ask you about the history of the organization, but I wonder if that’s even – since you’re changing so much and you’re so forward-facing right now, I don’t even know, is that something you even want to talk about right now?

NG: I know who built the organization, three farm owners, ladies. They decided to do something for the community, and really CMS started as The Hospitality Center. It was a trailer going around with food, with clothing, to find the farmworkers during that time that needed some support and some connections to the basic resources. It stayed like that for a long time. Long, long time.

LM: And that was in the 50s, or…

NG: 56, 1956.

LM: So like, 50-plus years.

NG: Yeah. And so I think there was a period of growth, like, early 2000s maybe, where CMS started to do English classes. That’s where our tamal/tamales program started, as a way of fundraising for the resources that were needed. And then I have a gap in information, and then that’s when I joined, later on. I didn’t have a chance to talk to previous directors. Everything that I’m doing, it’s basically new.

We survived for a year that we really used to gather the information to start making changes this year, and start implementing some of the changes. We know that we’re going to keep growing, we’re going to keep learning and changing every year. We understand that the next five years, it’s a learning time for us. To see exactly what is the, if our strategic plan worked the way we wanted and if it’s meeting the goals that we set at that time.

And yeah, I think, it’s good to remember the people. Give them the credit. Otherwise I wouldn’t be here. Otherwise people wouldn’t be receiving the services that they’ve been receiving for so many years. And we have some of the families still around, you know – the Talbott’s family. That is one of the very well-known in the community. And they’re still contributing and they’re supporting – not only the people that they bring, the people that they hire every year, but also, they’re part of our board, they’re part of the changes happening. Just knowing that we have their support, it’s something that we really appreciate and value.

LM: Yeah, absolutely. What’s the most useful way that people can help?

NG: Well, the first one would be, donate! We again, we are funded through grants and individual donors. 60-80% of our funding comes from individual donors, which is huge compared to other organizations. We have a really good donor base. This is the way that we are able to provide the services, create new programs, and grow. Without our individual donors, I think it would be pretty hard.

And we want to make sure that the whole entire valley knows what we do and I know that not everybody knows. This is our work. To make sure that they do, make sure that they know we are here, either if they need us or if they know somebody that needs us. And donations are a great way to support our programs. If they want to donate, if they want to tell us, I want my money to go directly to this program, that’s something we can do. Or just general operations.

The second one, if people want to come and volunteer, we’re always in need of volunteers. With the resource night, serving the meals, that takes a lot of power and energy and everything. So if people want to come and help us serve the meals, setup, cleanup, that’s something that we could use.

We also have special events. We have an annual concert that is our biggest fundraiser. Put it in your calendar – September 9th, we’re going to have our concert. We bring Quemando, it’s a salsa band coming from Boulder, and it’s a night of dancing and just having fun! Really enjoying our food – we sell our famous tamales, and everybody just gets to enjoy the music, enjoy the culture, and again, that’s a way that we collect a lot of our income. That’s our bigger fundraiser. We also need a lot of volunteers for that.

LM: How do people sign up to be volunteers?

NG: That’s another thing that we are creating – our procedures. We want to make sure that when you come in and ask, we want to know why are you interested in helping? Do you know a little bit of Spanish and want to practice more? We want to place you to do something where you’re actually going to have the connection to the community and you’re going to get to do that.

So we are starting a new process where you would have to fill out an application and from that application we would learn where is it that you would like to help and then we will give you that option. So that form has like, different options, and then we’ll go from there. We’ll let you know what are the opportunities to help, we’ll arrange schedules. And that’s going to be coming up on our new website. So we’re going to have our new website that really shows all the changes that we’re implementing.

LM: Is that going to be rolled out in coordination with the open house?

NG: Yes! April 19th we’ll be able to look at our new website and new name, new email, new Facebook.

LM: That’s so exciting! Lot of work, but exciting stuff.

NG: Yeah!

LM: So you mentioned the tamales, and that’s something that, even when I first moved here, I kept hearing rumors about: you’ve gotta get the tamales! You’ve gotta get the tamales! So, what’s the best way for people to actually order tamales and how did y’all start offering that as a fundraiser?

NG: I think that tamales, it’s very cultural. Whenever you, even as a family, whenever you have a need, you’re going to think of – let’s make tamales and sell tamales. And that I think came from a group of people that used to be teachers here, that they saw a need for making a little bit more money to bring into the organization and they had the skill. Making tamales takes skill!

LM: Yeah, and so much time!

NG: Yeah! A lot of effort. This person decided he was going to start making tamales and he was going to start selling tamales. And ever since we do it as a fundraiser. And I think everybody knows us because of our tamales. It’s really interesting. I think the first thing that I heard when I joined as an ED was like – are you going to make the concert? And do you have tamales? Those were the first things that people asked me. Yeah!

So, we have tamales available. Right now we are getting orders through our website. On the website, you are able to order and pick the kind that you have. Obviously if we don’t have, you won’t be able to see that they are in stock. But if they are in stock, you will be able to pick from pork, chicken, and vegetarian. I don’t think there’s anybody in town that makes vegetarian tamales. Literally vegetarian tamales. All the ingredients are veggie-friendly.

LM: Like, no lard, or anything like that?

NG: No! Yeah, it’s really, really interesting. And they’re delicious, I just have to say that. They’re delicious. So we have them for sale, $25/dozen, and you can order through our website and that’s also going to be on our new website.

LM: Awesome. I’m glad that wasn’t my first question, then!

NG: Thank you!

LM: That’s so typical!

NG: I appreciate it.

LM: But like we had to get around to it! My stomach just growled when you were talking about it, too! Another thing that I think people ask about or maybe aren’t as clear on is the thrift shop next door. And that isn’t technically really part of this organization anymore, is it?

NG: It’s not. I think it used to be and I’m not sure, to be honest, when the transition happened. They are their own organization. However, since they are connected to our building and they’re also known to support people in the migrant community, it’s a great, another great resource to have next to us. They provide clothing and whenever they’re closed, then we try to support them with some referrals, but basically it’s a great place for them to find jackets, boots.

When they come, the first group that comes, and I’m talking migrant seasonal workers, usually H-2A visa holders, they come around January. And that’s a very cold time and a very unpredictable time that we really don’t know if it’s going to be sunny, or is it going to be raining, or is it going to be snowing. And they don’t come ready for that. You would say, if they’re coming every year, why don’t they bring their own jackets? I think it’s about also the resources. They pay for their own transportation. Obviously, they get reimbursed. But in the meantime, they don’t have a lot of resources. So the thrift store really supports in that way. And also, the families that are around here – again, we are super far away from everything, so having a thrift store really supports our mission.

LM: What’s one thing that you wish that people knew about the community that comes here to work, whether it’s a migrant or like, a permanent immigrant? Like, what’s one thing that you think is misunderstood that you just wish everybody knew?

NG: So many things – I don’t think I have just one.

LM: Top three!

NG: Top three. Ahh yeah, so we don’t, we’re not here for like, a couple of hours. I think the first one I already mentioned, and I can’t remember where I read this, or maybe I’m just talking about my own personal experience… Yeah, let me speak out of experience. I would say that it really took us, us meaning my family, it really took us about four to five years to feel comfortable here. To feel welcome. To feel that we knew a little bit about the systems – education system and also in the financial part, to feel that we were, that we started to feel better about our finances. More secure in that way. Not really because we were greedy or something, like you know…

Again, the reason why we migrate, and the idea of migration that we forget or maybe we don’t acknowledge, that migration – it’s natural. And because it’s natural, it shouldn’t be judged. It shouldn’t be attacked. It shouldn’t be seen as something unusual. That it should be something that is respected. Something that is admired! Because people leave their hometown, the place of birth, not because they want to. Not because they are willing to leave everything behind. They do it because they want a better life. And that’s just such a human thing!

Everything that we do – for us, for our families, it’s because we want to give a better life to our next generation. And it doesn’t matter what it takes. It doesn’t matter if it’s leaving everything, risking everything. Putting your life at danger. It doesn’t matter. It’s still going to be a better place. You’re still going to risk it to have a better life.

And when we think about now, the now, and the reason why people are migrating, why people are leaving. It’s because they are not safe. And that’s super sad. And we don’t recognize that. We only think of – ay! You’re coming over here and you’re taking my work and you’re taking this away from me. And not understanding that it’s not because we want to. It’s a sacrifice that we have to do.

I didn’t want to learn a second language. I struggled learning a second language. I still struggle understanding – the learning, it never stops. It’s a new word. It’s something new every single day. And, who wants to do that? No one! You are put in that space, as a child. As babies! I have so many friends who came here when they were babies. They didn’t get to choose. Again, it doesn’t mean that you’re going to blame the people that took that decision for you, because they wanted the best for you. They were only thinking for the best of your interests.

So those are the things that I wish people think, when they’re thinking of a stranger next to their home. Or somebody at the store that looks different than you. Or somebody that is driving and they have a different color skin. You know, we don’t think of those things. We don’t make it personal. I hope that people make it personal. I wish that people make it personal. I wish that they would be wearing their shoes for at least a day. Because, again, coming to a place that you don’t know – and, some of the people are blessed enough to have family, some of them are not, some of them come into cities that they’ve never been to, that they don’t know anybody, and, imagine that? Imagine walking into that space. Not knowing the language, not having a job, not having a place to live. And those are things that we have to survive.

And yeah. That’s migration. It’s a real thing. And should be natural. Should be something that, instead of saying, I don’t know you, we should say, I welcome you. How can I support you?

LM: People forget that a huge percent of their ancestors and everything did exactly the same thing. And you know, if they weren’t coming here from somewhere else, they were displacing someone else. And like, throughout our history, people have moved. And that’s never going to stop! It’s just going to continue.

NG: No, it won’t stop. But I think we could learn from it! And we could embrace it. And we could create better systems. Currently our immigration system – it’s so broken. And old fashioned. And it just creates more obstacles to people that are trying to do better. And the answer, it’s, no you can’t. And it’s hard. It’s hard to think that, we can’t do better? I think we can. As a humanity we have so much to learn, so much to change.

I know, like, I know it takes time. I know it takes changing mindsets. It takes a lot of courage to say, wow, I don’t think we’re doing that right. To be accountable for the mistakes that we have done in the past. But, we can change. It’s just a matter of understanding that, at the end of the day, we’re humans and we need to support each other. And love each other. And accept each other. Instead of seeing differences among us.

LM: That’s so beautifully said. How many people do you usually serve – like, what’s the size of the population that you’re usually working with?

NG: Last year, we served between 400 and 500. And that could be maybe repetitive members from different years. I believe there is about 300 visas that are given out every year, or that come to this area every year, so that’s around the population that we try to reach. If we think about immigrants that settle here, we’re thinking about more than that. I believe we are 23% of Latino population in Grand Valley [LM note: that is the percent for the state of Colorado]. Based from last census. That was what, two years ago?

So we are growing pretty fast. Definitely we are next to other counties with higher populations that are much smaller and are growing even faster, that are creating the services that their community needs, and we sometimes are staying behind.

So it’s really interesting to see the number of people that come in, the number of people that are out there, and the number of people that we could be reaching.

LM: How did you get into this as a career? What made you want to do this?

NG: So, I came to United States when I was 12, and obviously, had to learn the language. I came when there wasn’t – I think the school district was just starting with creating the English as a second language program. I remember we used to live in Riverside and I would have to take a bus all the way from Riverside to Grand Mesa Middle School, which is like, Clifton area. And then, the community started to grow.

Obviously I had to go through the system. I started in middle school, then high school, then college. And I started to see the need in our community. The needs in our community. How we were not able to connect to some of the resources that were granted for other people, and how language played a big role in it.

So, even though I started to see that, I wanted to be an architect! I wanted to build houses, I wanted to make houses! But then, I didn’t have the resources to go to architecture school. And so I started in Spanish, as a Spanish major.

People would ask me, so, you know Spanish, but you’re taking Spanish as your major? And I was like yeah – just like English can be a major! I learned so much, you know. I learned about – in my transition, as a child, I lost a lot of my education. The literature, the history, that I didn’t learn, because I was busy learning a second language. And that was a time and the privilege that I had to be able to go to school and learn that at that time. And my grammar, you know. I didn’t know the grammar, the rules in grammar. It was really hard to say, like, I don’t know where an accent goes, or I don’t know what kind of word this is.

So I had the opportunity to learn that at that time, but that was also the connection that I got to the community, and that’s when I started to get more involved in community. The first time that I got super involved was I became part of a youth group in high school. And that group decided to do an event. We wanted to celebrate the Mexican Independence, and we were able to do a community event, bringing everybody together. And we did it in Riverside. I think we closed off some roads, we brought a band, vendors, and we did like a big festival.

And that’s when I learned – I want to be involved with the community. I want to be able to connect with the community and just be around. So, as I graduated from college, I started to get more involved. I started to join community organizations that were involved with social work. With immigration reform. And I joined organizations, joined boards.

Then later, that’s when I found the job with the school district, and it was with the migrant education program. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. Then I learned that, I wasn’t really that far away from what I really wanted to do. In that program, I went back and realized that, I did my community service in that program, and then years later, I was working for that program.

And it was really nice to remind myself that, this is what I want to do. I want to make sure that I connect with community, that I can empower, that I can help, that I can help connect and provide resources. And that was basically my role – to find community that were eligible for the program and connect them to the program. And it was really nice because the program is connected to 20 school districts around us. They cover western slope. And we got to travel. We got to go different places. We got to go to Delta, to Eagle, to Steamboat. Like, different areas. And that was really, really nice to be able to do. Not only learn from your community, but learn from different communities. And people growing in different other communities.

And that’s how I – then I got this opportunity! I worked here two years ago, as an outreach person first, but it was for about a month – summertime, and I learned a little bit. I volunteered also, previously to that, but you know, volunteering and working is different than being THE leader. When the position opened up, I wanted a bigger challenge. I thought I was ready for a bigger challenge. And applied. And I think I’m here because of the experience, because of my background, and what I can give to this organization.

LM: What’s a typical day like?

NG: This year is changing. Last year we were short staffed and it was hard. I was new in my position, and we were only two. And we were serving about 300 people. The first meal that we had last summer, we had about 100 in a day, and there were only two of us. So, it was really hard.

Last year I was learning everything that the community was needing, everything that we were supposed to do as an organization. We were working on our strategic plan, we were working on so many things. So it was really hands-on last year. Very hands-on. I was helping serve meals, I was helping organizing the whole meals, resources. I was taking a lot of roles and a day was really, really hard. I enjoyed it. I learned a lot. But now, it’s different. As we start to have a bigger staff, I am now finally able to take my ED role. Which is another learning curve for me. I am enjoying it.

A day, it’s, right now, planning our re-branding event. All the pieces that we need to get together for that to happen. Working in programming. What are the resources that we want to provide this summer. How the calendar looks like. And connecting to resources in the community. Making that connection. In order for them to come here, I have to do my work and connect to them. They’re going to be busy. And sometimes they’re not going to connect to me. So I have to do that part. Connections. So a lot of meetings. Trainings. It’s important, this is a time where I really need to get, to learn the skills I need to be able to do my work. So I am taking a class. I try to benefit from different trainings that are available out there. And also talking to other organizations that I can learn from.

So yeah, a day, it’s being on the computer, organizing, planning, and connecting to community. And then my other part is supporting my staff. Supporting my new Office Admin. Right now, it’s only two of us, again. But I know that, in a week, we’ll be three, which, that’s going to feel great. It’ll continue to be the challenge for me to learn everything that I need in order to be a good leader.

LM: When you do get a day off, how do you enjoy it?

NG: I haven’t had a day off!

LM: IF you do get a day off!

NG: I hope that I get at least a half day off. I already have plans for that. I have different things that I need to do in my personal life that I need to take care of, and that’s really the time that I have. I’ve been trying to do a lot of more self-care. Last year I did not do good in self-care. It’s hard. It was hard. I was working really long hours. I would work here, and then take a break for dinner, and then keep working.

And I realized that that was not going to be sustainable for me. And not a model for the people that I’m working with, because I care about them too, and if they see me working, they’ll continue to work, and I don’t want that. I want them to know that there are limits to the work. That we cannot take care of the community if we don’t take care of ourselves.

That’s like, one rule that we have to remember, as service providers. You really can’t do that. You have to take care of yourself. Mentally, your health. Spiritually. Because it can be really, sometimes, hard, when people don’t understand the changes. They can have a different perspective, and sometimes that perspective, they’re not going to tell you in a beautiful way, and I am the one receiving those negative comments. Which I understand. It’s about information, giving information and why we’re going that route.

So on those days, I just disconnect. I just try to disconnect. I literally leave my phone in the bedroom, I turn it off, and then even, just spending time with my husband, spending time with my mom, my sister, my dad, that are here locally. Just even taking them out to eat, or spending dinner with them, spending the day shopping. Literally trying to disconnect from the daily work – that’s my best therapy.

LM: What’s your favorite thing about the community in this area?

NG: Favorite thing… I don’t know if it’s a thing, or what you would classify as a thing!

LM: Or whatever! I don’t know, like the view or the farmer’s market or…

NG: OK, that’s easier.

LM: …or Oscar!

NG: Yeah! I love the valley. I am in love with the valley. Every time people ask me, would you go live somewhere, I say, no. And it’s – I come from Mexico City. A huge city.

LM: Huge city!

NG: Huge city! And when people tell me, you don’t want to go back to a huge city, I say, no! I’ve been here for such a long time. And it really took me long. To be able to say: this is my home. This is my home, too. It took me a long time. To feel welcome. To feel part of the community. And I don’t want that to happen to other people. That’s what I do. That’s the reason that I do everything I do. I don’t want the same feeling to go to our new people, because I know what my family and I went through. And I think that’s why – I think it’s so hard to think of another change again. To say, oh, I’m going to go to another place. It’s not like language – when you learn a second language, you are able to learn many more. It doesn’t work like that! It’s different.

And, yeah, I love Grand Junction. I love the mountains. I love the blue skies. I don’t think I was able to see like, this clear blue sky in the city. Or the beautiful stars at night. The fresh air. I didn’t see that. I remember the city in a different way. I remember the city thinking of my family. Thinking of my cousins, uncles, aunts, my grandma, you know. That’s what I remember. I don’t remember the city as a place, I remember city as the people in there. The people there.

But it’s different here. I’ve been here for 23 years. I think of Grand Junction as the place that I want to live and I want to stay at, but also, like, my home. Yeah. And yeah, again, when people ask me would you like to move somewhere, I say, no.

But also, I miss the mountains. Every time I get to travel, even though I’ve been to such beautiful places, I miss the mountains, you know. Those beautiful skies. When the sun is going down, and you see the orange, and you see the teal in the sky, and the white, and all those beautiful colors – you don’t see that any other place.

LM: No, I love that so much. And that moment, when you catch it, when everything has that pink light on it – it’s just so special.

NG: And I think I’m so – like, where my office is, you can see all the mountains, but when I come in, obviously I come in in the morning, but then, I literally go home at the time that the sun is going down. This is a reminder – go home, Nelly! But it gives me the chance to see that. To see the beauty of nature and that we are surrounded.

I don’t get to go a lot to nature. I don’t get to go hiking in the Monument, I don’t get to hiking at Mount Garfield, or even go to the Mesa. But I know, in the times that I’ve been there, it’s like such a big privilege to have such beautiful nature around us. And to be able to say that, we do take care of it. And to be here and feel safe.

LM: Well thank you so much for your time, and for everything that you do for the community, and for just, your passion – it’s awesome. Thank you.

NG: No, thank you for giving me the space to share a little bit about me, share a little bit of La Plaza, and our vision, the changes, the excitement, and basically share a little bit of our community.

We’re going to have our open house on April 19th. I think we’ve already started to advertise our new name, so it’s not a secret! We’re going to have the open house, our new website’s going to launch the same day. Our new website is laplazapalisade.org. We’re also going to have our new Facebook page, also La Plaza. What else?

LM: What time is the open house?

NG: Open house will be from 5-7. We’re going to have dancers, music, and we’re going to have tamales. Light refreshment. And yeah – please come enjoy your time here! Our board is going to be here. If you haven’t been in the building before, it will be the opportunity to get to know the changes around the building. We’ve been doing remodeling here and there. Last year, city of Palisade was generous to help us remodel or really change our backyard, so there’s a lot going on. So come, enjoy yourself, and it’s really our time to celebrate all the work that we’ve been putting into, so much work. And so much planning. But I think it’ll be a great opportunity to really get to know the new Plaza.

LM: I’m really looking forward to it! Thank you so much, thanks for sharing your story, and for everything. I appreciate it.

NG: Pieces!

(music starts)

If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com.

The Postcards from Palisade podcast is available on all major podcast distribution platforms like Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Stitcher. Find us and subscribe now so you never miss an episode. We also have a website, postcardsfrompalisade.com, where latest episodes and links to more information are posted.

Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.

E3: Colorado Association for Viticulture and Enology (CAVE) – Cassidee Shull

Today I’m talking with a star of the Colorado wine scene, Cassidee Shull. Cassidee is the Executive Director of the Colorado Association for Viticulture and Enology, aka CAVE. We chat about the Colorado wine industry, the events CAVE has planned for the year, how Cassidee got her start in the industry, and what her favorite things are about Palisade. We also have a very special guest in-house…Jilly the puppy!

For more info about CAVE or the Colorado Mountain Winefest and other events, check out their websites: winecolorado.org and coloradowinefest.com.

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that’s all about the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Today I’m talking with a star of the Colorado wine scene – and her new sidekick – to find out what’s going on in Palisade and the wider Colorado area in the wine industry today.

Thanks so much for spending some time with me today.

Cassidee Shull (CS): I’m Cassidee Shull, I’m the Executive Director of the Colorado Association for Viticulture and Enology. We produce Colorado Mountain Winefest and a VinCO conference over here in Palisade and Grand Junction.

Lisa McNamara (LM): And if we hear anything in the background, any chewing, who is that?

CS: We are here in my office in Palisade with our little puppy, Jilly, and she’s enjoying a little bone behind us.

LM: So for somebody who maybe hasn’t heard the terms viticulture and enology before, what does that mean?

CS: Our organization has a very long name; we’re more affectionately know as CAVE, but viticulture is grape growing and enology is winemaking. We are a 501(c)(6) trade non-profit. We were established way back in 1987 as an all-volunteer board over here in Palisade by winemakers and grape growers here in the area, and we are set up like a chamber of commerce. We have several membership tiers, winery and vineyards, allied trade partners, other organizations that are interested in being part of the organization, maybe retailers, real estate offices, things like that. Cork companies. And then individual members, so amateur winemakers and the like.

And so our whole organization exists to support winemaking and grape growing throughout the state, through education and research. And we do that through a couple really big events. Mostly the consumer-focused event folks are more familiar with is Colorado Mountain Winefest, and then all the proceeds of that go back to the industry through our trade conference held every January called VinCO.

LM: And what would a member of CAVE get? Like, what benefits do they get by joining?

CS: Several benefits through all three of those tiers, but the big ones are discounts to a lot of those events. We put on many educational seminars throughout the year. We hire a full-time lobbyist that monitors and legislates on behalf of the industry, and monitors alcohol-related bills for us.

Like I mentioned that conference we put on – it’s a four day multi-track trade show and conference held over here in Grand Junction. We partner with the Western Colorado Horticultural Society and put together four days of industry learning, and we bring in folks from all over the country and sometimes all over the world to speak to our industry on winemaking, grape growing, business and marketing, and a very large trade show accompanied with that. And then we do a lot of marketing and outreach on behalf of the industry, through Winefest of course, that event brings in anywhere from 4,000 to 5,000 attendees for several days in September.

So, a lot of different things! We also run an amateur wine competition throughout the year for our amateurs, bringing in judges from across the state to judge amateur wine. So, a lot of different facets.

LM: With the amateur winemaking, I looked at that a little bit online, and there were a lot of different award winners, so that made me think – there must be a lot of entries!

CS: Yes! We range anywhere from I’d say, 80 to 90 to over 120, depending on the year. And then, what’s really, really cool about that event, is we get to see amateurs enter year over year and maybe get a bronze, a silver, a gold medal, then gold, double gold, year over year, and then really get those comments and feedback from our judges. And then get that praise, and just really want to step up their game, and then go on to open a commercially licensed winery in the state. So, just really seeing that stepping stone and being part of growing the industry itself.

LM: Jilly is jumping on me right now. She’s so cute! She’s so small! She’s so tiny!

CS: She just really wants to be part of the interview!

LM: So that’s cool, you get to see them grow and progress over time and really get to know people as they get started. That’s really cool.

CS: Yeah, we’ve been part of – or not been part of, but just gotten to see the industry grow. One of the CAVE board members, Juliann Adams with Vines 79, actually was one of our amateur winemakers for many years and opened her winery during covid.

LM: Oh wow!

CS: And she’s located right here in Palisade.

LM: Well I did have one follow-up question about VinCO – the average person maybe wouldn’t necessary know it’s going on, but it just seems like such a great venue and important resource for winemakers and grape growers in Colorado. What do you see being kind of – the few things that are most in demand for people wanting to learn about?

CS: So you’re exactly right, VinCO is a very industry-focused event. A lot of folks don’t really even – if you were a consumer on the street, don’t really know it’s happening in the convention center, especially in the middle of January, but we’re seeing a lot of folks in the industry really focused on water right now. We’re obviously in a drought…years…in the western slope, and in Colorado in general.

And then in winemaking and viticulture in general, we’re really focused on the types of grapes we’re growing. 2020 was a really devastating year for everybody, of course with the pandemic, but in the wine industry, we suffered a very, very devastating freeze out here in Palisade and even up into the West Elks area. It was late October, we had an over 70 degree shift in temperature in 24 hours, and lost – I think the final count was I think 70-80% of all vinifera.

So we’re really looking at hybrids and different types of grapes that grow well in Colorado. As you know, our climate is very temperamental! We could have very late spring frosts, or very early frosts in the fall, so we’re doing a lot of research and winemaking techniques with different types of hybrids that consumers maybe may not be as familiar with. So you’ll see a lot of those sessions at previous conferences. We have all of those available on our website and then looking forward to what will be available in our 2024 conference as well.

LM: And then, y’all also do another event, the Barrel into Spring, right?

CS: Yes, that’s a newer one! This will be our second year we’ve offered that event. That was a long-standing event put on by a previous wine association here in the Grand Valley that we’ve taken over. It’ll happen in one weekend in April and one weekend in May and feature tastings from seven separate wineries – seven wineries in April and seven wineries in May and then – barrel samples and then food bites at each of those locations as well.

LM: Barrel samples – I think it’s such a unique thing. It’s not something that somebody can get every day, right?

CS: Yes.

LM: Like this is kind of your one chance to do it.

CS: Absolutely. So it’s a definite heightened experience than what you would see just behind a tasting bar. And really, I like to think of it as like, really glimpsing into the future. Because you’re again tasting something that’s not even been released yet, it’s not fully developed yet. And then have the ability to say, like, I really want to purchase part of what’s in that barrel. So you’re kind of just tasting futures almost, which is exciting.

LM: It wasn’t obvious to me at first when I started reading about the event, and then when I started hearing or understanding a little bit more, like – oh, you’re actually tasting something that you can’t get any other time of the year.

CS: Yes!

LM: And it’s seven different wineries each weekend, so it’s really a chance to see like, fourteen different wineries and what their products are going to be like in the future. It’s a really cool event.

CS: Yeah, I absolutely agree, and if folks are really looking for that unique experience – you’re tasting wine that will literally taste different, a week later, even, because it’s still not completely aged and not finalized. We’re all living in that moment of experiential and very unique experiences, and so that’s what I always think of. And I’m like – oh yeah, we’re tasting something that we’ll never have again, because it’s gonna be different when it’s bottled, or even different when it’s sitting in that barrel a month later, two months later.

LM: So, a lot of my questions are really Palisade-focused, but I know that CAVE doesn’t just focus on Palisade, obviously, or even just the Grand Valley AVA. You focus on Colorado as a state, in general.

CS: So we are actually working with the Colorado tourism office on a marketing grant right now, and we’ve highlighted and through a lot of research of where folks are touring and tasting from – and to – three main wine regions. So we have two American Viticultural Areas, the Grand Valley AVA which is here in Palisade and the West Elks AVA which is up in Paonia and Hotchkiss area. We’re highlighting both of those areas. There’s about 30 plus wineries here in Palisade, another 25 or so up in the West Elks region and outlying areas.

And then we are also highlighting the Front Range wine region. And the Front Range wine region, we are very broad in pulling from Boulder and Fort Collins all the way down through the downtown Denver area, and then there’s wineries all the way down to Colorado Springs, Canyon City. And so if you’re out wanting to grab a bit of food or see a ball game and then want to grab a tasting – glass of wine at a tasting room, you’re able to do so literally just about anywhere in Colorado. We have wineries all the way down at the Four Corners region, we have wineries in Evergreen. We have wineries literally on the continental divide! So it’s really a unique state to drink Colorado wine – wine in general obviously, and then where our growing regions are as well.

LM: Over the last ten years or so, how has Colorado wine production changed?

CS: Exponentially! When I started, just over twelve years ago, we had just over a hundred wineries, and about the same vineyard production, but we’re now sitting at over a hundred and seventy wineries.

LM: Oh wow!

CS: And that includes wine, cider, and mead, but it’s really exciting to see how far the industry has come, and the perception of Colorado wine has changed significantly. We have wineries that are being written up in Forbes, and Wine Spectator, and Wine Enthusiast, and our regions are just getting such great press and representation, which is just so exciting to see!

LM: Yeah, it is really exciting. I mean, I’m obviously a big fan of Colorado wine. So we were talking a little bit earlier about the ballot initiatives in 2022. There was a lot that people were able to vote on last year in terms of wine, wine availability, and the one that actually passed was wine in grocery stores. Can you talk a little bit about the one that passed and if CAVE had an official position on any of those initiatives?

CS: Yes, there were a lot of initiatives involving alcohol and wine. Our organization did not take an official position on any of them. I don’t believe! This was a while ago, and we have a lot of legislation coming down right now. The one that did pass was wine in grocery stores. We have such a large representation of our membership that some would benefit from, some would not, and we felt that it was in the best interest to let our membership kind of go forward with what works best for them rather than take a position that may negatively impact one or the other.

From vintners, restaurants, limited wineries – we have liquor stores we represent as well. We have immediately seen – I mean, that went into effect just earlier this month, twenty days ago or so. We have some that are making use of that and have seen placement in Whole Foods and Trader Joe’s, City Markets and things like that. And then some that are just continuing on with direct to consumer or liquor store placements. But it’s definitely a shift overall in the model for sure.

LM: Yeah and I imaging that it would be a very complex issue for this position, where you are really trying to elevate everybody.

CS: Yes! And we are a small industry. As you know in California and some of those bigger wine regions, they’re like, wait, you don’t have this? This is old news! But those are also very large production industries. On average I’d say the Colorado wine industry is about 1,000 to 2,000 cases per year [per producer]. We do have several wineries that make much, much more than that, and then we have some that make less than that. But to fulfill some of those case orders, or some of those orders for some of these larger grocery stores or convenience stores, that’s when you get into some of those, like you said, those layered and complex issues.

LM: That makes sense.

CS: It may work for some, it may not work for all.

LM: Right. If you need to take her out or anything, we can totally pause too! They need to go out a lot, right?

CS: I think I’m gonna give her – I have a little toy for her.

LM: Oh, oh yeah!

CS: I’ll put it out here so she’s not…

LM: She’s like, distracting me with her cuteness! I’m like aww, aww! Anyway, but for the upcoming year you mentioned that there were quite a few things currently in legislative session relating to the alcohol industry. What kind of things are you seeing?

CS: Yeah, there are lots of things happening in the legislative world regarding alcohol. Currently our organization is working on a festival bill to assist with the amount of festivals a winery – or cidery, brewery, distillery – can attend in a twelve month period. So that would really assist with the wineries’ ability to attend festivals, sell wine by the glass or bottle, and just be able to have that be an additional extension to their business model.

LM: So there’s a limit today, then?

CS: Mmhmm.

LM: Oh, interesting, so they’re capped, so really, a winery would need to say, OK, I need to pick…

CS: Mmhmm, plan out their year.

LM: …a certain number of festivals, and I’m gonna try to figure out which ones are going to be most useful to me and yeah – I can see how that would be really challenging. Anything else or is that kind of the big one right now?

CS: That’s the big one, definitely, that we’re working on.

LM: The other cool thing I noticed on your website, I noticed that CAVE offers a scholarship program.

CS: Yes!

LM: While we did just pass the deadline for this year…

CS: Yes, I have all the emails drafted, ready to go out to the recipients!

LM: That’s such a cool opportunity. Can you talk a little bit about what that’s for or traditionally who it’s been awarded to?

CS: So this is a scholarship program we began, oh goodness, several years ago, before covid. And we wanted to make the barrier of entry really, really easy, and low. So it’s for any CAVE member or their employees or staff. The board, or our staff, can apply. And it has to go towards something in viticulture, enology, or marketing, or business-related. And that’s it! It can go towards classes, a seminar, a session, a TIPS training, anything of the sort. And we’ve offered it, like I’ve said, for the last several years.

Unfortunately during covid, we had to pull back that program. We weren’t able to offer Mountain Winefest. It was the only year it’s ever been canceled in 2020. And that’s our biggest fundraiser, so that was unfortunately one of the biggest programs we had to cut. And this is the first year we’ve been able to bring the program back, and we’ve been able to double the amount of funding we’ve been able to offer through our scholarship program. So with that amount of money we’ve been able to offer, we’ve also seen an increase in the amount of applicants. Which really made myself and our board really happy.

So that application deadline was earlier this month, and our board met earlier this month as well and went through all of our applicants and saw all the programming they were requesting funding for – so it’s everything from UC Davis winemaking courses to TIPS training courses to tuition assistance for our Western Colorado Community College Viticulture and Enology program. So really, anything in the realm of viticulture and enology or winemaking and grape growing, just to encourage and further their education and training. We don’t care where it exists in the world, we don’t care if they’re going to a course on the other side of the states or the other side of the world or if they’re taking an online certification program or a WSET class, a certified somm class – we’re just excited to help support that additional education and training. And that they’re doing that and we can be a part of that.

LM: Yeah, it really helps benefit the local community – anybody who is a CAVE member or anyone in Colorado. That’s a really cool thing. Obviously a lot of the production of wine, grapes, fruit, everything in the valley wouldn’t happen without migrant workers.

CS: Yes.

LM: They take on a lot of the labor. What if anything does CAVE do to support migrant workers?

CS: So we’ve worked closely in the past with Child and Migrant Services. They’ve been partners in our Colorado Mountain Winefest in the past. Like I said, all of those scholarship opportunities are open to all. And then we work closely with the Western Colorado Horticultural Society, so all of these organizations are intertwined, and like you had said earlier, all of these programs are intertwined, and the product is intertwined. It’s a huge, huge amazing organization and without them, this organization would not exist and this industry would not exist.

LM: Right.

CS: And they’re doing phenomenal work here in the valley. Our lobbyist is also monitoring anything that’s involving the H-2A program and anything that would impact, either positively or negatively, what goes on with our migrant workers as well.

LM: Of course. Makes sense. What new things are Colorado winemakers doing that you’re really excited about?

CS: We’re seeing a lot of amazing collaboration between our own industry – so, it could be alternating proprietorships, so wineries working on different types of…

Jilly: starts noisily lapping up water, continues for a long time for a little puppy!

CS: …wineries working on each others licenses or sharing barrels, sharing ideas, things like that. To different packaging and different types of collaborative efforts to different types of new and exciting wines and varietals. We’re also just seeing a lot of, kind of that trend in hybrid wines and blends. There’s a lot of, kind of a shift in events, and because of that festival permit I had mentioned earlier, we’re seeing…

Colorado Wine Walk is a really good example. This is a new event that’s taking place in downtown Denver in April and I believe again in August, where they’re inviting a lot of wineries onto their premise in just a new and fun way. I think they’re having nine to twelve wineries with little tables, with a wine check, just a very new – I don’t want to say improved festival, but just more of these urban feel, urban vibe, instead of like, Mountain Winefest for example, where you’re down in Riverbend Park or park atmosphere, just kind of a new take on a festival atmosphere.

LM: What do you find most challenging in promoting Colorado wine?

CS: Definitely the ability to change folks’ perception. When you’re chatting with folks about Colorado wine and they’ve had it in the past, maybe five or ten years ago, it may be hard for them to put those negative connotations, or, if they’ve had something a long time ago and they were like – oh, it wasn’t for me, it was too sweet, or you know – just change that. And so events like the one I just mentioned, or a wine fest, or a tasting, or a wine paired dinner, is a really great way to showcase how far the industry has come and how new some of these wines and blends and new hybrids that are coming out would be a great way to introduce some of these – just how great these wines are.

LM: Like I mentioned earlier, I’m from upstate NY and I worked in the Finger Lakes wine region for a season, and it was a very similar challenge for NY wine. A lot of people had had it ten or twenty years ago, when it was more like jug-style, really sweet. And you know, they’re like, ugh, I don’t like NY wine. And so that was a really big issue, getting over that perception of it being all sweet jug wine, when actually they’re doing really amazing Rieslings and cold climate red wines. So that’s interesting. I think a lot of the smaller, less known wine regions probably struggle with something similar.

CS: Yeah, and we bring – uh, her name just escaped me, the folks from Red Tail Ridge, they come out and have spoken at VinCO. And they do just a fantastic job.

(door opens) Rondo: Oh, you’re in a meeting?

CS: Hi Rondo!

Rondo: Call me when you’re done.

CS: I will. Don’t let the puppy out!

Rondo: I won’t. Hi puppy, I didn’t even see you! (door closes)

CS: He’s somebody you should talk to! But their wine is amazing, and very similar. And one of the best comments we get – I don’t know if that’s the right way to phrase that, but when folks come and taste and tour through Palisade, is, oh, this was Sonoma 25 years ago, or this was Napa 30 years ago.

And we very much lean in to this wine region, to Palisade, being very small and quaint, and very family focused and very family oriented. There’s a very high chance, when you’re tasting here, that you’re meeting, or having wine poured from the winemaker, the owner, the cellar manager, the vineyard manager – most times they’re all the same person and most times they’re husband and wife or they’re related. But it makes for such a unique experience and story-telling. I mean, you’re getting from front to back how they got into the industry, how they got into this lifestyle, and why they make the wine they do. And that’s not unique here, it’s for the whole state of Colorado. You’ll hear the same from the West Elks region, from downtown Denver, from the Four Corners, the Rocky Mountains as well.

LM: That just helps contribute to the really friendly atmosphere too, because it is so familial and welcoming.

CS: Absolutely.

LM: Like we just saw Rondo walk into the CAVE office – you’re located in downtown Palisade. If somebody were to stop in, like – do you have people stop in? And if they do, what sort of information can you provide them?

CS: Yes! We – so I work here in our office with our program director, Melinda Tredway. We’re a small team of two. And we are here year round. We have the ability to offer literally anything and everything for folks that come in off of the street. We have maps of the area for just the area of Palisade, and then we can answer anything and everything for the wine industry on a statewide scale as well. We have a tiny little retail shop. We have all the previous years’ Winefest posters, we have Winefest merch, we have Riedel glassware, t-shirts, things like that.

But we do get a lot of walk-in traffic around high season, which for us starts probably April through September/October. Folks looking for best places to taste, places to eat, where to stay, what to do while they’re here on their visit. So, yeah. We like to think of ourselves as like a little visitors’ center or info desk for the wine industry. So, if you’re around, please stop in and come say hi. We also have a lot of dogs in the office! We have our little puppy and then Mel has two little German Shorthaired Pointers named Stella and Nelson. So it’s a little doggy petting zoo in here!

LM: Yeah, stop by for some wine info and some dog pets! Oh my gosh, she’s – what is she doing? She’s somehow like rolling – she’s trying to get me to pet her belly, like, in the air. OK. Ah, so, personally, I have tons of job envy for your position. How did you get into this and what made you want to do this for your career?

CS: I graduated from Mesa State/Colorado Mesa University. I graduated the year the school changed names, with a degree in Human Resource Management and Business Management in 2011. And didn’t – I knew what I wanted to do, I just didn’t know where I wanted to do it. I really wanted to work in non-profit.

I had done a lot of work in service clubs and student clubs on campus, my whole student career. When I graduated, I just started sending resumes everywhere. I had moved here from Costa Rica – my family and I lived in Costa Rica for several years. So I was like, oh, let’s get out of Junction, let’s go back to the big city, let’s go to Denver, so I was applying to places all over the state essentially, but not here.

I think it was my mom or my grandmother that found literally an ad in the Daily Sentinel and they were like, you should apply for this job! And it was an Executive Director position for an organization I had never heard of, but it was event planning and volunteer coordination and things that I had done all throughout my career at school. And I applied, thought there was no way they were ever going to call me back, because I was just out of college, but they did. And then they called me back again for a second interview and I was really excited and really thrilled.

The other part I was very upfront with – I was like, I don’t have any wine background. I – my degree is in business and human resource but not wine. We don’t have a wine program at the school yet. But it was just what they were looking for. They were at a point where they were doing an organizational restructuring of the organization, so previously it was all volunteer-led, and they had a director of the festival, but not of the organization. And so it was a good time to come in and just take stock of where the budget was and where things were going and they were just looking for somebody with some social media background and taking it into a new direction.

LM: And it sounds like an opportunity to have grown together and have grown the organization together.

CS: Absolutely.

LM: What a cool opportunity.

CS: Yeah, it was and I’ve been here ever since. It’s been a huge learning experience for everybody since I’ve been here, but I would not have traded anything for the world. It’s been a wonderful honor and privilege to grow alongside this industry and see how far the wineries have come, the growers have come, and just the industry overall.

LM: What’s a typical day like?

CS: Definitely depends on the time of year! The first quarter is all conference – our VinCO conference is in January. We shift into Barrel Into Spring around this time. Winefest applications go out. Summer, spring and summer we’re really focused on Winefest. And then if you’re here in August and September, it’s like, all hands on deck getting everything ready for the festival. The whole office will transform into a bunch of boxes. But we’re still open, taking questions and calls and folks that need something – we’ll just maybe have more stuff here.

And then in between all of that we’re running board meetings, budgeting, strategic marketing sessions. Definitely after covid a lot of our meetings shifted to zoom, so I’m on my computer a lot, but it’s nice because we’re able to connect with folks all over the state and all over the country a lot easier without as much travel. But it’s definitely – every day’s a little bit different. Meeting with sponsors, meeting with different groups we work with and things like that. It’s awesome.

LM: I’m sure you can’t ever, ever mention to anybody what your favorite winery is. That’s a secret that never leaves your lips.

CS: Yes!

LM: But, what’s your favorite wine to drink – your favorite varietal or wine?

CS: I drink a lot of – this is not a secret, people ask me this a lot.

LM: I’m sure!

CS: I drink a lot of really big, bold reds. So, Cab Franc. Pinot Noir – not as big and bold, but red. And Malbec. I’ve become a really big fan of Petite Pearl recently, drinking a lot of hybrids. And then for whites, I like a really dry, like Sauv Blanc. So, I drink a lot of everything! A little bit of everything, for sure.

And when folks come into the office, we do get that question a lot. We have a little booklet here for the area and then for the state of, you know, what do you like? Do you like sweeter wines, drier wines, fruit wines, ports, and then we’ll send folks to their respective wineries, and if they’re a big party we’ll call ahead and let them know we’re sending a tasting group of ten or more. But we try and get them to where they’re going with a glass of wine that they’ll enjoy at the end.

LM: What’s your favorite thing about the Palisade community?

CS: That’s a great question. It’s very friendly and it’s very tight knit. Sitting on the tourism advisory board for the past twelve – goodness, eleven and a half, twelve years – there’s always something to get involved in or something to do.

We just had an amazing event happen I think last weekend that was called Sing up the Sun that was kind of an homage or welcome to the equinox, and it was all just put on by a community member that just wanted to see a new event happen this time of year, which is a but slower for us. We’ve not yet hit spring, or, I’m sorry, early spring, like summer festivals. Farmer’s market’s not up yet. Our honeybee festival’s not here yet. And to see – I think the first one was last year but to watch that event take off and it’s all community-led and volunteer driven, and people came out with poems and dancing and costumes and puppets and I was like – this is amazing! And it’s all just a small community put-together.

Our Olde Fashioned Christmas is I think another example of that where, I don’t think I’ve seen another community put that on, outside of like, a Hallmark movie! Or like our Trick or Treat street is very similar. This is a very Halloween town event. So, that’s definitely what comes to mind is how niche and wholesome I would say it is.

LM: When you do get a day off, how do you enjoy your day off? If you don’t mind?

CS: That’s also a good question! I play a lot of video games. This puppy is keeping me very active, doing a lot of training. And then I – if I can schedule it (in)correctly, I go to HOTWORX, like a yoga studio here in town, to work out. Or I’m out tasting! I’m benchmarking wines.

I do love live music and supporting live music and local music. Both my brother and my partner are in bands and I mean, a handful of my friends. So there’s always something happening. We have a great local music scene here on the western slope. If it’s not on the western slope we’re literally traveling to go see music on the front range or surrounding areas, but it would probably be supporting one of those two bands, either my partner’s band Zolopht or my brother’s band Peach Street Revival.

Or, just literally popping in a local music venue and just seeing who’s on stage. I’m a really firm believer that – very full circle to that event I had just mentioned, that Sing up the Sun event – that art is everywhere. I used to be a dancer and so being able to see somebody on stage that you know has rehearsed and put so much time into their craft, whether they’re playing guitar, or playing drums, being able to share that with them, just on a Thursday night at a farmer’s market or something, I think is really special.

LM: Last question is, what’s another person or organization that you’d love to hear from on this podcast in a future episode?

CS: I think Child and Migrant Services would be amazing. The Chamber of Commerce has a lot of things going on, so they’d be a great one. There’s a lot, I could just email you a whole list! The Chamber would be great, the Town of Palisade would be great, I think, because they, between what they do for the town and then the events they put on as well – they put on Bluegrass – I think would be an awesome one.

LM: Thank you so much for your time. It was really great to talk with you.

CS: Absolutely! Yeah!

LM: Where can people find out more information about any of the events or about CAVE?

CS: If you are interested in learning more about the non-profit, the Colorado Association for Viticulture and Enology, our website is winecolorado.org, so you can find everything about the amateur wine competition, our scholarship program, and VinCO on that site. And then if you are interested in learning more about Colorado Winefest and the events and tickets and things like that, that is coloradowinefest.com.

LM: Thank you so much, Cassidee!

CS: Thank you, this was amazing!

LM: If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com.

The Postcards from Palisade podcast is available on all major podcast distribution platforms like Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Stitcher. Find us and subscribe now so you never miss an episode. We also have a website, postcardsfrompalisade.com, where latest episodes and links to more information are posted.

Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.

E2: Paddleboard Adventure Company – Danny Tebbenkamp

Featuring Danny Tebbenkamp, the owner of Paddleboard Adventure Company. Learn about the fun and unique events Danny and his team host – paddleboard yoga or a community float, anyone?, find out what airboarding is, and hear why Palisade is where Danny wants to be. Strap on your life jacket and remember the warmth of summer on this early spring day. Let’s float down the river with Paddleboard Adventure Company…

For more info about Paddleboard Adventure Company, including their upcoming events, find them on Facebook, Instagram, or their website.

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that’s all about the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Today I’m talking to Danny Tebbenkamp, the owner of Paddleboard Adventure Company. Keep listening to learn about the fun and unique events Danny and his team host – paddleboard yoga or a community float, anyone?, find out what airboarding is, and hear why Palisade is where Danny wants to be. Strap on your life jacket and remember the warmth of summer on this early spring day. Let’s float down the river with Paddleboard Adventure Company…

Thanks so much for spending some time with me today.

Danny Tebbenkamp: Name’s Danny Tebbenkamp. Our business is Paddleboard Adventure Company. We do paddleboard rentals as well as ducky rentals and tube rentals for the river and lake. We also do lessons for those who want to learn how to paddleboard – whether flat water or if they want to get on the river and do river paddleboarding, we do that. And then we do tours as well – basically we just have – we call it the SUPSquatch, so we do tours on that, where people get onto one big board together and we just take them down the river. We do ebikes as well – ebike rentals and ebike wine tours, which have become quite popular.

Lisa McNamara: And where are you located?

DT: Well, we have a couple locations, but we started in Steamboat Springs – we have a shop there. Then we have a kiosk at Pearl Lake State Park, up near Steamboat, and then we have our Palisade location.

LM: How long have you been here in Palisade?

DT: This will be our third season, so 2021? Yes. I had to think about that. Is that right? Yes, that is right.

LM: And why did you decide to expand over to Palisade?

DT: Well, it’s kind of – not a long story, but the short of it is, we’d been in Steamboat for awhile, just kind of getting over the cold and the snow, and we had a buddy who honestly wanted to move from the front range for a number of reasons and we were looking to be around him more as well, and we had some friends here who were also in Palisade, and we were like, well, if he’s moving to Palisade and we want to get out of the snow, and we have other friends out here, and we have great access to rivers out here, we decided to just start looking into it and searching, we came across a house here.

So we bought a house here, because we wanted to be local – we eventually want to be local and live here, but, six months after we bought, our buddy reached out to us and said hey, we have a space that’s for rent – do you want to rent paddleboards out of it? And so that kind of began the story of, oh, well, if we’re going to live in Palisade, we might as well have a little business here too, and we’ll just expand our paddleboard company.

LM: What made you originally decide to open your own business, and specifically this business – gear rental, and tours, and things like that?

DT: Well, I’ve always been an entrepreneur. I have another company back in Steamboat – the company’s a great company but it’s not an exciting company. It didn’t really feed my adventurous spirit. So back in ‘09, I decided to branch out and do something that was more down the vein of what I wanted to do – which was, back in the day, back in ‘09, it was – we did wakeboard, wakesurf lessons, we did backcountry what was called airboarding trips, we did snowkiting, a bunch of crazy things. A couple of them took off, a couple of them met just limitations with permits, or insurance, or competition, so.

Back in ‘09, I was kind of toying with paddleboarding, because I had seen a guy doing it on a river and I was like, oh I want to do that. So I started in ‘09, just doing it on my own on the river and lakes and then in 2012, I just changed my company to Steamboat Paddleboard Adventures, because we were in Steamboat and we just did paddleboard adventures back in 2012. And I just started from there, just expanding out and growing my fleet. At that time it was the new and hot thing – well, actually, at that time, it was still kind of – people were like, what are you doing on a river with that thing?

LM: Right, because it was kind of a flat water thing, like lakes. And even that was kind of new.

DT: Yeah. It was a flat water or even an ocean thing.

LM Before we go forward – air – what was it, airboarding? And snowkiting?

DT: Yeah!

LM: What is airboarding? It sounds wild.

DT: It’s really fun. So we’d take people by snowmobile into the backcountry. They’re inflatable sleds that you ride face-first, kind of like a boogie board. And they have molded runners so you can actually carve through the powder and you can get some good speed. That was actually quite popular, I had a couple people come back every year to do it, and then eventually, insurance and permits were just a pain and not worth it. But it was fun for a couple years there doing it. But it’s a great way to enjoy the snow, or alternative way, if you don’t want to snowboard or ski.

LM: And so then I’m imagining that snowkiting is like kiteboarding but with a snowboard? That sounds wild.

DT: Yeah, like what they do in the ocean but doing it on the snow. Yeah.

LM: Oh! So this is like, a little bit tamer now!

DT: Yes, well, some of the whitewater I wouldn’t call tame, but yeah, around here, it’s – there’s not, unless you’re going out to Westwater and running those big class three rapids, it’s mostly tame around here, which is what most people want, and that’s what we want to offer.

LM: So, the other thing that I think is really interesting about what you do here is that you have a bar and shop. What made you decide to add on a bar?

DT: Well, it’s kind of been a dream of mine to have a bar, but I didn’t just want a bar. So I think it’s a great marriage of – we’re just an apres bar, meaning that we’re just a place you land after the day’s activity. Apres means after an event or after an activity. And so we think it’s just really cool to have a space that people come back from whatever adventure, whether they’ve rented from us or done an activity with us or they’re just biking by or hiking by, and they can sit down, belly up to the bar, and tell a story. And I feel like having a drink in hand is probably the best way to do it. It’s just a cool marriage of the two. I want to hear what they experienced if I didn’t take them out, I want to know, well, how was it out there, and have a beer while you’re telling me it.

Sorry, is that the – I can unplug that thing.

LM: Uhh…it is pretty loud.

DT: Want me to unplug it? I think it’s my cooler.

LM: OK!

DT: That’s just my kegerator. It should be fine. OK – do we need to go back and say all that again?

Anyway, it’s just a cool marriage of having a place for people to land after they’re paddleboarding or biking, whether they rent from us or do an activity with us, it doesn’t really matter. It’s just kind of cool to have a place after the day’s activity to land.

You know, it’s really big in the ski industry and so we just brought it to the paddleboard industry, where you come here and have a drink and tell us your story from the day, because I’ve always hated it when people would rent something and they would just come and drop their gear and leave, and I’m like, oh, I don’t even know – I’d try to talk with them but they wanted to get on and have a drink somewhere. And like well, shoot, now I can provide that.

LM: I think it’s the best-kept little secret bar in town too – it’s such a welcoming space and you’ve got board games laid out on the tables and really good pricing. What about the name, The Sneak Line? It’s probably just some term that I just don’t know.

DT: Well, it’s intentional to have it kind of unknown. It’s river slang – as you’re scouting a rapid to run it either via raft or paddleboard, you just have to see what’s the best way through, and sometimes it’s going through the meat of it – we call that punching the meat. And sometimes it’s called sneaking by – it’s the sneak line. There’s some times in big rapids might have a consequence if you hit that wave, you’re like oh, I need to get around that, you just take the sneak line around it to keep yourself safe or maybe to keep people on the raft that don’t want to get super wet, or get flipped. So yeah, it’s a cool little melding of the word. Uh…melding…that does not sound right. Anyway.

And then also someone had said, well it’s actually kind of cool – who knew nothing about it being a river thing – you’re kind of off the beaten path, so to get here you kind of have to take the sneak line to get – because people don’t know where we’re at.

LM: That’s good!

DT: Yeah, I like that too. I didn’t think about that when we made the name.

LM: What’s the biggest challenge of running your own business?

DT: Well currently, it’s just staffing. I think most people probably would agree with that. There’s a lot of places I could expand and do this model elsewhere, but I just don’t have the personnel. Palisade I do have a great manager and I have a couple returning staff year to year, so that’s helpful. But there’s still a couple holes to plug but, in Steamboat, once the summer hits, then I can barely get down here because I’m so busy in Steamboat, because up there, it’s hard to find people to work. More so than Palisade.

So that’s one of the biggest challenges. The other thing is being spread between three locations and trying to give my equal time to all of them and making sure the locals and my employees know that I care – that I’m not a distant owner who just doesn’t care. That could be a lot of time travel and a lot of extra longer days if I’m traveling from one place to the other. And then the books – just making sure you’re in the black most end of seasons and not in the red. I feel like, with Palisade, we’re still in our third year so this year should get us over the top and Steamboat and Pearl Lake have a little more history and momentum, so they do a little better, but it is what it is, part of the growing pains.

LM: Well what’s the best part about it?

DT: Oh man, I think just meeting people and getting those people out on the water to do something they’ve never done before, or just have an experience with family and friends. To know that we’re proving a service that people are getting to do things that they haven’t done.

This is kind of a cool industry. It’s about the people. And it’s really cool when you get good employees – I have a few in Steamboat and a couple here that come back year after year and those are fun connections.

LM: What I think is really cool about what y’all do is that it’s not just about gear rental – you have a lot of really fun events and even the rentals that you do are wild – like the SUPSquatch! I’m kind of obsessed with that. So can you describe what it is a little bit?

DT: Yeah so the SUPSquatch it’s just a big paddleboard. It’s about 15 feet in length and about 8 feet wide, I think. Don’t quote me on that, but we usually put six people on there with a guide. It could be less than six. If we’re not floating down the river, if we’re just sitting on a lake, I’ll cram as many people on there as they want to go and they can just have fun on it. We rent one on Pearl Lake and it’s a great little barge for a party barge for wedding parties or kids. It’s a great babysitter for parents. Like hey, I want to put all ten of my kids on this board and push them out on the lake and I can sit on the shore and not be annoyed.

You know, because if you’re all on your own paddleboard or your own ducky, you might be socializing a little bit as you’re floating down the river, but people can just kind of go off and do their own thing then in that situation. But on a SUPSquatch, you’re all stuck together.

This year I’m excited, we have two new…unfortunately the one we had last year is getting retired, it’s just so beat up. But we’re bringing in two new ones that – I don’t know if they’ll hold as many people, I think there will be four people with a guide, but you can get both of them and we can dock them together. But the SUPSquatch is just a unique – it gets everyone by surprise – what is that?

LM: And do you include a guide just because it’s so big to manage on the river?

DT: Yeah, just for protection of people on the SUPSquatch and also just for protection of the SUPSquatch. They’re not cheap, so we just like to have them managed by a guide.

LM: Makes sense. It makes it a cooler experience too because then people just get to float and it’s totally unique.

DT: Right.

LM: So that’s cool. And then something like SUP yoga just completely blows my mind. Like I’m not – I can’t do yoga on ground, and there’s a picture of someone on your website standing on their head on a paddleboard! How does that even work?

DT: Well the headstands, you know, that’s not for everyone, that’s really only the yogis. We never tell – we never have people do those things. Because that’s not where we’re trying to land. Yeah, I think it’s interesting, we get that question all the time, you can’t do it on land. Well, the worst case, on water, you’re going to fall in the water. But our instructors aren’t going to – it’s very basic yoga on the paddleboard, and it’s amazing, even just being on a paddleboard and doing some of the minor yoga moves, you get off the board and you just feel energized, your core is worked out, you’ll feel it the next day, and it’s just a fun way to get out of a sweaty studio, crowded studio, and get open air, fresh air. Like I said, worst case is you’re going to get wet, is what I tell people.

LM: And so are you going to be offering those classes again this year?

DT: We have three on the calendar right now – we call it Float and Flow. We’ll do yoga on flat water and then we’ll get on the river and just kind of float down.

LM: Very cool. Can you talk a little bit more about the guided wine tours on the ebikes? Do you have a set route with set wineries or do you just go where people want to go?

DT: We do have a – we’ll, we’re working on a set route and I think I can say, I can almost say that it’s official. We’ll know this weekend. So we have three – it’s four hours but we have three stops. Forgive me, I’m going to need your help on this, the first place we go is Miaison? (Varaison)…

LM: Oh, Maison (Varaison). You don’t want to ask me to pronounce things but I know what you mean. Maison (Varaison)!

Correction! Apparently, we’re beyond hopeless on pronunciation, because the winery that we’re talking about here is Varaison Vineyards. Thanks to sharp-eared listener Karen for pointing out the error. Now, back to the previously recorded podcast. Just remember…Varaison!

DT: Yes, OK. Yes, so, I’m sorry, if you’re listening to this, I can never say your name. But they’re really great people and why we stop there first is because they do the whole wine tasting experience. Maison (Varaison) is really cool with that, they give you the whole, how do you taste wine, how do you know if its – you know, just all those things. So that’s a really cool experience.

So then we go from there to Talbott’s, and Charles is really great, so they get their tasting, but then he gives the whole tour of the agricultural side, and how they do their ciders. So drink in hand, you get to see the whole behind the scenes that a lot of people don’t get to see.

And then, this one’s not official, but I’m pretty sure it’s going to happen. Clark’s – they’ve got the distillery right on the river, so it’s a cool place to land where people can get food, because by this point they could be hungry or want a snack. Which, I heard Talbott’s is actually doing food too, so there might be a couple options, but Clark’s is nice because now we have mixed drinks involved, so if people want to try a cocktail, they can have a cocktail there.

Clark’s also has a dock on shore off the river now, so then people can see the river and – hey, tomorrow, if you want to get on a paddleboard with us, we can float on by here, or you can float on by here and stop for a cocktail or you can just be with us and we can float this river that you can now see from Clark’s. That’s kind of our one-two-three punch. And then they’ll land back here at the Sneak Line and we always offer a drink here, if they want any more drinks, as part of the wine tour.

LM: That’s a really nice variety of things, and it’s a good distance too. What would you say it’s about, mileage-wise? Probably six to eight, maybe?

DT: Yeah, it’s actually a nice little route because you go toward…

LM: That’s not that bad!

DT: Because you go toward town and then you go up on the East Orchard Mesa, and then you get that nice loop around the river, so it’s actually a really cool, scenic one too, maybe six, eight miles.

LM: Yeah, and you’re on an ebike too, so if you want a little assist, you got it. Especially going up that hill!

DT: Yeah, going up 38, it can be a little – but yeah, we’ve tested, tried and true, our bikes make it up there, even with the steepness of the hill.

LM: What other events are you planning in Palisade here this season?

DT: We’ve got quite a variety of things. We’re going to go back to some of the standards from last year, which was the open mic – well, it’s not an open mic, I should say, it’s story night. So the mic is open and we have a theme and people come and tell a story based on the theme. We did that about three or four times last year, so we’ll do that again throughout the season.

We have our community floats, once a month, those are always popular. One of those will be the Pride float, which last year I think we had over 50 people, so this year we’re bracing for – I think we’ve already had people calling on that. That’s become quite popular, the Pride float, that’s in June.

LM: OK, and so can people rent – if they don’t have their own ducky or kayak, or something, can they rent here too for the community floats?

DT: Yeah. We’re typically rented out, so it’s like, get the gear early so you can have it, because if you don’t have it, we can rent it to you, as long as we have it in the inventory. So, the floats, the story time, we’ve got a couple historical nights. We did that last year – bring in the historical society and just open our bar and they can tell us the stories of Palisade or whatever theme we suggest or they suggest.

We have the yoga we’ve talked about already. We will do – we work with Harmony, the animal shelter. I think it’s Harmony, yep. And we do like a dog adoption, dog wash day. Which was fun. I think we saw like four dogs adopted last year, so that was a cool little event.

And we have a couple other fundraisers we’re still planning. We’ll do our Bike Palisade, which will be every third Thursday – not in April, but starting in May we’ll be doing that through the summer.

And let’s see – what am I missing? The best – I tell people to stay up to date you’ve just gotta follow us on Facebook or Instagram. That’s usually the best. Our website doesn’t keep up with that because there’s so much of it. That’s where you’re going to find what we’re doing.

And then this last year, and we’ll continue forward with this, we did a fall festival in October. We had some axe throwing, food trucks, it was really a cool time. And then we did an Artisan Market in December and then we did a ski and snowboard wax party in February. So even though we’re closed in the off season we try to do an event a month just to keep our name out there, so people know that we’re still here! We’re all in it together.

LM: Well it’s also really fun, unique things that you’re offering for the community that other people aren’t really doing. You seem to be finding the interesting little niches that other people aren’t working on right now.

DT: I think it just kind of goes back to – you know, we’re going to live here, we’re local. We live in Steamboat but we’re not trying to be those guys that aren’t connected to their community. We want to be connected and the best way to do it is through these events, and so that’s been cool.

LM: What are you most excited about for this upcoming season?

DT: Oh man, I think – I think we’re just hitting our stride, Palisade specifically, just because we, we’re in our third year, we’ve got good traction with everything we’re doing, we’re bringing on some new boards, some new events. We’ve got like, just, there’s a new buzz. Seems like people have been talking, sooner than in years past, OK, we’re ready, we’re excited.

The ebikes, I think we’re going to see some new traction with that too, because we’ve been doing that for our wine tours, we’ve heard from people that they like to do it that way, what we’ve been doing, just like a hand-held, guided, we got ya, here’s where we’re going to take you, you’re going to see some really cool things.

And then Pearl Lake, we just started a bar there last year, we have a lakeside bar. And I could work there every day. Just sitting on the shore, renting boards. I think there’s a lot of buzz going on right now for what we’re doing and I’m excited just to do what I need to do to help out where I need to help out – so I’m expecting a busy summer for myself.

LM: Yeah, I’m excited to get started! I want the summer to get here…

DT: Yeah, right? The river’s going to be amazing too, with all the snowpack that we’ve got building up. So we should have hopefully a nice, maintained river season. (squeak) Sorry – a nice, maintained river season! The sounds of the shop.

LM: You got it, you’re a professional. Alright, the last couple questions are more about Palisade. So – what’s your favorite thing about the community here in Palisade?

DT: Oh man…I think…well, it’s fun to like, go to certain place and see people you know from certain walks of life, around town and be able to just strike up a conversation. They say, as you’re shopping or out and about, don’t plan to – what you think might be a 20 minute stop to the grocery store is probably going to be like, 45 to an hour. Because you’re going to talk to people. So, that’s just a mindset that – back in Steamboat years ago, that’s kind of what it was, and I miss that. Steamboat’s just such a hustle bustle and busy – you see people, but everyone’s in such a rush now.

Here everyone’s still like in the slow pace, anywhere you go you’re going to run into somebody that you know or kinda know, but they’re so friendly that they’re going to talk to you – like hey, aren’t you that guy…or how do I know you? So I just love the community aspect of just the closeness, kind of we’re all in it together, you know? At these events we’ve done, I get a good handful of people that come every time, and it’s just, it’s a close knit. So that’s one of my favorite things.

LM: Same!

DT: And just the opportunity of the many activities that from here you can go into, you can springboard into, whether it be up on the mesa or on the river right here through town, or going out west. So I just think it really affords anyone who lives here to get outside and do an adventure. Those are probably my top two things I like about Palisade.

LM: I hear you – same! If and when you get a day off what’s your favorite thing to do with your time?

DT: Well, I’m kind of one of those guys that roll with the philosophy of work hard, play hard. I’m very good at putting – not to pat myself on the back, but – putting events on the calendar, even during the summer. Like, I’m a big river rat, obviously, but not always paddleboarding. We have our own raft and my family and I have done multiple river trips. So we have a couple already planned this summer. I’m like, well guys, I’m leaving. Don’t burn the ship, or don’t sink the ship, I’m going to be gone for a week on this trip to whatever river. And so, we just love that time with our family and friends to get on the river and just be rowing for a few days, going through whitewater, camping out under the stars.

If I only have an afternoon, well it depends on what the season is, like in springtime you’ll see me surfing the river wave in Steamboat every day, which someday I’m hoping we’ll have here. If I can be in the water, I’ll be in the water. Or near the water.

LM: They were going to do a river park here at one point, and it just seemed like too many challenges with the canal and the dam.

DT: Yeah, and there’s still going to be some challenges, I think there’s just – where they put it is kind of key. And the agricultural industry just needs to be – not convinced, but just be – what am I trying to say? We need to just let them know, we’re not taking your water. We’re just, as it’s going to your land, as it’s going to water your crops, we’re just gonna surf it as it’s passing through. We’re not taking it, it’s still going to get to your land, and where it needs to go.

It’s gotta move from A to B, so as it’s moving, I might as well surf it! You know, we need to just have certain things in place to make it surfable. And there’s so many mountain towns that have proven it to be an effective model and a very profitable model. BV/Salida probably the leaders in that. But you know, it hasn’t hurt anything down there.

I mean, get a surf wave in a canal, that’d be the easiest thing, it’s already constricted. But it’ll never happen, unless you get somebody who’s a big river surfer that owns a lot of land and agricultural and says – that’s what I do! Let’s make it happen in my canal! Anyway, I could talk all day, I’m super passionate about it.

LM: Who would you most like to hear from on a future episode?

DT: Oh, of your show? Your podcast?

LM: Yeah!

DT: Oh man…Rondo. Charles over at Talbott’s – or Bruce, maybe both those guys. Jeff and Jody – they’re doing a lot as far as this town and positive growth. And then I think Kaitey over at the Livery. She’s a really good friend of ours. She’s the bar manager over there and she’s also been super helpful for us. I think those are – a lot of people, but there you go. I’m curious what they would all say.

LM: That’s great! Well, thank you so much for your time, I really appreciate it.

DT: Yeah, thank you.

LM: You were actually one of the first people that I told, like the first few people I told about this idea last year. Even the first time I met you, you just have such a warm and welcoming attitude, and I’m sure that’s why people love to come back here, and it’s awesome.

DT: Well, that’s great. I wonder if my kids would agree on that sometimes. No, I think this is a great idea, good on you. I’m always for the entrepreneurial spirit, and I feel like I’ve had a few people help me out along the way – well, not a few, a lot, so I’m just kind of paying it forward as I go forward, looking for those opportunities and helping out where I can.

LM: Well, I really appreciate it, and cheers to the first podcast guest!

DT: Woohoo! I can’t wait to hear it!

LM: Thanks!

DT: Thank you!

LM: If you’re looking for something different to do this summer, Paddleboard Adventure Company is a good place to start your search. You can keep up with the latest by following their socials.

DT: Facebook is just Paddleboard Adventure Company-Western Slope. I think that’s the same for Instagram. And also if you go to our webpage, paddleboardadventurecompany.com, the links to those are there.

LM: Danny and his team are working hard to build their piece of the community here in Palisade. They’re a great reminder that community is what you make it.

The Postcards from Palisade podcast is available on all major podcast distribution platforms like Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Stitcher. Find us and subscribe now so you never miss an episode. We also have a website, postcardsfrompalisade.com, where latest episodes and links to more information are posted.

If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com.

Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.

E1: Greetings from Palisade!

For our very first episode, we’re sending you a special greeting from Palisade. Learn a little more about the town of Palisade, your host, Lisa McNamara, and what you can expect from future episodes. 

Music by Romarecord1973 from Pixabay.

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Transcript:

Hello and welcome to Postcards from Palisade, the podcast that’s all about the people and places that make this slice of western Colorado wonderful. I’m your host, Lisa McNamara.

Have you ever wondered what its like to run a winery or a hotel in one of America’s most beautiful small towns? Or do you want to get to know your neighbors better? We’re here to give you a snapshot of the people, businesses, and history of the Palisade area with stories for locals and visitors alike.

Today, in our first episode, we’re sending you a very special greeting from Palisade! Keep listening to learn a little more about the town, your host (me!), and my plans for this podcast.

Palisade sits in the easternmost portion of the Grand Valley where the Colorado River exits the Rocky Mountains and starts its journey through the canyonlands of the Colorado Plateau.

The Uncompahgre band of the Ute people first lived in this area before they were forced to relocate. The first settlers arrived in the Palisade area in the late 1800s and quickly realized they could use water from the Colorado River, which borders the southern end of the town, to grow peaches, grapevines, and other crops. After coal was found in the cliffs to the north of town, coal mining, in addition to the orchards and the vineyards, sustained the town in its early days.

Palisade was named for the tall cliffs, aka “palisades,” that line the northern edge of town. These cliffs help create a unique microclimate, along with other surrounding features like Grand Mesa, that makes this area a touch warmer than its neighbors. It’s high desert country with lots of sun, warm days, and cool nights.

Now home to over 2,500 residents, Palisade is still known for its peaches and wine, though coal mining has gone the way of the dinosaurs. The town is home to over 500,000 peach trees and 1,000 acres of vineyards, which produce about 90% of the grapes used in Colorado wines made both here and around the state. Palisade is part of the Grand Valley American Viticultural Area (AVA) created in 1991. The town’s population swells on festival weekends during the summer as visitors and locals alike gather to listen to live music, eat peaches, celebrate honeybees or lavender, and drink wine.
https://visitpalisade.com/the-history-of-palisade-our-story/

So that’s our little town. But who am I, and why am I doing this podcast?

My path to Palisade was as winding as an old, untrained grapevine. (I have great similes.) Having growing up in a small town in upstate NY, I was eager to get away from country life and explore the US and world. After graduating, my now-husband, Paul, and I moved to Chicago and spent the next eight years taking in everything that the big city had to offer: shows by all my favorite performers, food and drink I’d only read about, an inspiring art scene, people from all over the world, and easy access to faraway destinations via major airports. But I missed nature and biking and the outdoors, and that was all harder to find in Chicago.

So back before Instagram was big and vanlife was a hashtag, Paul and I quit our jobs, sold or donated most of our stuff, and traveled around the United States for a year in a minivan. After a wonderful, but savings-depleting year, we went back to work and over the next decade lived in upstate NY, Wisconsin, Chicago again, and Fort Collins, where, during the pandemic, we got itchy feet once again. So we bought a pickup truck and a small camper that fit in the bed of the truck, quit our jobs, sold or donated most of our stuff, and lived on the road again full time for fifteen months.

That’s when I got a taste for making podcasts. I created a podcast called Road Tripping in America while we lived on the road full-time. But the travel podcast world never quite seemed like the right fit for me. We were often out in the backcountry somewhere, visiting places that I didn’t really want to tell lots of other people about and not seeing many other people to talk to. And full-time road life also didn’t feel like a great long-term fit. We missed having a community, having local friends we could invite over for dinner, seeing familiar faces in the post office and at the grocery store. We were tired of looking for a new place to sleep every night. We had been moving so much and for so long: fourteen moves and over two years on the road in the past twenty years. We were exhausted!

We knew we wanted to stay in Colorado, so we sat down and made a list of our criteria for the perfect location. Walkability. Affordability. Culture. Friendly people. Easy access to nature but also to an airport. Then we looked at all the options. And right at the top of our list was the little town of…Montrose, CO.

That’s not Palisade! Nope. It was not Palisade. We were all in on Montrose, but after a few months of trying and failing to find a house there, with the winter weather closing in, we decided to rent a place in a nearby town to catch our breath. And the best place available for rent at that time just happened to be in Palisade.

We had visited Palisade before and loved it, but worried that the town was too small and for Paul, too hot in the summer. Still, facing the alternative of another winter on the road, we decided those fears did not outweigh the known difficulties of wintertime vanlife. So we moved into the rental and collected our remaining house stuff from storage.

In Palisade, we biked through the vineyards and had a happy hour glass of wine at places we’d only ever visited on vacation. We shopped for local produce from the farmer’s market and marveled at the delicious Palisade peaches, plums, melons, and Olathe sweet corn. We gazed out our windows at the kinds of views we’d have had to drive miles down a backcountry road to enjoy. And, most importantly, we were embraced by the warm and friendly community. We had accidentally found exactly what we were looking for. I didn’t want to start over again somewhere else.

Over twenty years, every step we took brought us closer to the right place for us. And despite all our research and analysis and pro/con lists, we ended up just stumbling onto it in the end. And now we’re staying put.

So hi, that’s me, but we are not going to be talking about me on the regular episodes. What I quickly realized is that there is an abundance of amazing people here in Palisade, with so many stories to share.

There are the owners and staff of the more than 30 wineries and tasting rooms, brewery, cidery, and distilleries.

The workers who tend the vines, orchards, and fields, pruning in the winter, harvesting in the summer and fall, and everything else in between.

The farmers growing peaches and other fruits, veggies, lavender, and lots of other crops. The people at the insectary who help them all out. What’s an insectary? Am I even pronouncing that right? Let’s find out together!

There are the restaurant and food truck owners who add their own flavor to the town.

The festival operators who plan legendary events.

The farmers market organizers who make downtown Palisade the tastiest place to spend summer Sundays.

The shop owners who are ready to rent you a bike, a kayak, or a paddleboard, or source you a cute hat or unique piece of art.

The local pedicab operators who offer a unique form of transportation and tours.

The hotel and B&B owners where visitors can rest after a fun day or locals can outsource their guest rooms.

The locals, who can share what’s it like to live here – from fun things like community bike rides to important services like child and migrant support to the same housing availability and affordability struggles and the kinds of cultural changes that most small Colorado towns are currently facing.

And there’s so much more. But you get the point. There’s a lot going on in this little town.

Right, right, OK, first I have to meet these people, then I have to convince them to talk to me on tape. Come along as we see how that goes! As a newer Palisade resident, I bring no assumptions or judgments to the table. And I’m not taking sponsorship or funding from guests, so you can listen knowing that you’re hearing a perspective that’s unbiased. I only want to learn all there is to know about this town and share the cool stuff with you all.

The Postcards from Palisade podcast will be available on all the major podcast distribution platforms. Find us and subscribe now so you never miss an episode. We also have a website, postcardsfrompalisade.com, where latest episodes and links to more information are hosted.

If you are interested in being on the show or if you have ideas for a future show, I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me at lisa(at)postcardsfrompalisade.com.

Thanks for listening. With love, from Palisade.